Hey Kid, Stay Away!
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Episode 10
Children shouldn’t kill people. It just feels like it breaks the laws of the Universe, right!? Not that adults should kill people either…but you know what we mean! Today’s episode is focused on children who kill and it’s spine chilling to say the least.
Because let’s be real, a child with a knife is giving Chucky vibes and we don't love that. We've got one kid who has a weird thing for Kool-Aid and another with a milky eye. It's less than appetizing, so i'd put down your lunch for this one!
Brandon kicks us off with the story of Eric Smith, a thirteen year old boy that tortured and killed a four year old. Derrick Robie said "it's OK mom, i'll go by myself," to Doreen Robie on his way to the park on the day he was killed. Well, it definitely was not okay because a creepy thirteen year old was out for blood.
Then, Kevin is taking us back in time to meet Jesse Pomeroy, the youngest person in the history of Massachusetts to be convicted of first degree murder. His mother tried to excuse the way he tortured animals as a silly little expression of sadness... mmmkay. His victims, Katie Curran and Horace Millen would certainly beg to differ.
If you enjoy the episode, leave us a rating and review and be sure to subscribe to our Youtube channel! And lastly, if you have a little Homotown murder you want to share with us, send it over to murder@homocidepodcast.com.
Transcript
00:00:02:08 - 00:00:09:19
Kevin
Welcome to Homicide, The podcast. Hi, I'm Kevin in.
00:00:09:19 - 00:00:10:24
Brandon
Hi, I'm Brandon and.
00:00:10:24 - 00:00:11:17
Kevin
Welcome to.
00:00:11:24 - 00:00:13:16
Kevin
Homicide, the podcast.
00:00:13:16 - 00:00:14:24
Brandon
Welcome to the.
00:00:14:24 - 00:00:17:23
Brandon
Very delayed homicide, the podcast.
00:00:17:23 - 00:00:18:19
Kevin
We have returned.
00:00:18:20 - 00:00:23:27
Brandon
We have we are safe, we are sound. No, we were not murdered. We are still alive.
00:00:24:00 - 00:00:25:06
Kevin
Funny enough, we.
00:00:25:07 - 00:00:28:19
Kevin
Have been out of commission for a.
00:00:28:21 - 00:00:29:17
Brandon
That's we are at my.
00:00:29:18 - 00:00:32:23
Kevin
Age. Yeah, we were in May. So basically we got home okay.
00:00:33:00 - 00:00:35:19
Kevin
Obviously you know that we're in a well, we start over.
00:00:35:19 - 00:00:37:03
Kevin
If you.
00:00:37:05 - 00:00:41:13
Kevin
Are listening to this podcast, maybe fast forward like a few minutes.
00:00:41:16 - 00:00:42:12
Kevin
Because.
00:00:42:14 - 00:00:49:13
Kevin
Really this won't pertain to you, I guess as much unless you watch this on YouTube. But we're in a different location. Recording today is.
00:00:49:13 - 00:00:51:25
Brandon
Very lengthy for no reason.
00:00:51:28 - 00:00:54:26
Kevin
Thank you. Anyway, we are recording from our.
00:00:54:26 - 00:00:59:24
Kevin
Office actually in Tampa, so if you follow us and know us, you know that we live in both New York City and in Tampa.
00:00:59:25 - 00:01:00:26
Kevin
Florida. Yeah, we've got a.
00:01:00:26 - 00:01:01:26
Brandon
Lot of dreams, y'all.
00:01:01:29 - 00:01:03:12
Kevin
You know, lots of dreams.
00:01:03:15 - 00:01:04:17
Kevin
But anyway, we.
00:01:04:18 - 00:01:15:19
Kevin
Were home for our home for the holidays. And really we go back and forth between New York and Tampa anyway. But we've recorded mostly in New York City with our producer Anna anyway, and it was off on a.
00:01:15:19 - 00:01:17:02
Kevin
Holiday and.
00:01:17:02 - 00:01:20:22
Kevin
We came to tampon to yeah, be.
00:01:20:22 - 00:01:21:23
Kevin
Here for.
00:01:21:25 - 00:01:26:07
Kevin
The holidays. Also, we own our house here and it's cool if I can City if you haven't been here.
00:01:26:09 - 00:01:29:10
Brandon
Anyway, then we got here and we decided that our mental health mattered a.
00:01:29:10 - 00:01:30:03
Kevin
Little bit. Yeah.
00:01:30:05 - 00:01:32:15
Brandon
And we're like, You know what? I need a break. I need a break from.
00:01:32:15 - 00:01:35:00
Kevin
We need a just a moment. Yeah. So a lovely.
00:01:35:00 - 00:01:36:25
Brandon
Week between Christmas and New Year's that we.
00:01:36:25 - 00:01:38:10
Kevin
We did didn't do much.
00:01:38:16 - 00:01:40:21
Kevin
Now we've got really high.
00:01:40:23 - 00:01:42:25
Kevin
Is a lot of it. A lot of.
00:01:42:25 - 00:01:45:10
Kevin
Food and I've gained quite a bit of weight.
00:01:45:17 - 00:01:47:27
Kevin
Really. But anyway we, but it.
00:01:47:27 - 00:01:51:01
Brandon
Was fun and it was worth it. And I don't know about you, but I needed that.
00:01:51:03 - 00:01:55:19
Kevin
I did need it too. So anyway, sorry that we didn't have an episode on the 26th of December.
00:01:55:21 - 00:01:56:25
Brandon
Or in the second.
00:01:56:28 - 00:01:59:15
Kevin
Which also meant that our giveaway.
00:01:59:17 - 00:02:02:06
Kevin
We we need to extend. So yeah.
00:02:02:07 - 00:02:07:28
Kevin
We're going to extend that and we'll share more information on that when we think about it because it just popped into my head that were so rude.
00:02:07:28 - 00:02:13:13
Brandon
We're so not prepared. This is how we live our life. So welcome Anyway. Anybody who knows us is probably just laughing at us.
00:02:13:16 - 00:02:27:19
Kevin
Okay, But Brandon. Yes, we're recording on Saturday, January 6th. This episode comes out this Tuesday, and I think it's worth talking to people about the experience that we had at the primary care doctor that we were establishing this week.
00:02:27:19 - 00:02:28:26
Kevin
Well, if they've seen our TikTok, they.
00:02:28:26 - 00:02:29:11
Brandon
Might already.
00:02:29:11 - 00:02:29:26
Kevin
Have seen that.
00:02:29:26 - 00:02:37:25
Kevin
Oh, I did share it on there. Okay, well, here's the story. Basically, Brandon and I went to go to we don't go to the doctor very often. And we're getting older because we're we're.
00:02:37:25 - 00:02:38:28
Brandon
Trying to do better about it.
00:02:38:28 - 00:02:39:07
Kevin
Yeah.
00:02:39:07 - 00:02:49:02
Kevin
And so we went to the doctor and in there they're asking all these questions. It's pretty great. Although at one point it was like, these are some pretty intense questions. Are you a bottom or a top?
00:02:49:02 - 00:02:49:08
Kevin
And I'm.
00:02:49:08 - 00:02:52:08
Brandon
Like, okay, let's start off with saying we didn't just go to a normal.
00:02:52:15 - 00:02:53:08
Kevin
No.
00:02:53:11 - 00:03:00:16
Brandon
Primary care physician. We went to a all inclusive queer physician group.
00:03:00:16 - 00:03:04:01
Kevin
If you're in the Tampa Bay area, it's called MetroHealth. They're fantastic.
00:03:04:04 - 00:03:05:22
Kevin
Right? Yeah. Yes.
00:03:05:25 - 00:03:10:20
Kevin
Anyway, we went to the one that's in Seminole Heights here near our neighborhood because we live in the north.
00:03:10:22 - 00:03:11:07
Kevin
So they ask.
00:03:11:07 - 00:03:14:08
Brandon
A lot of questions about, yeah, that would pertain to the queer.
00:03:14:08 - 00:03:15:09
Kevin
Life. I've never I've.
00:03:15:09 - 00:03:16:26
Kevin
Never answered those questions.
00:03:16:28 - 00:03:19:12
Brandon
Yeah. I've never had a nurse ask me if I was a top, but in reverse.
00:03:19:12 - 00:03:22:15
Kevin
I have an email and I was like, and like.
00:03:22:17 - 00:03:23:24
Kevin
Have you been sexually active? Yes.
00:03:23:24 - 00:03:29:19
Kevin
Have you give an oral? Oh, my gosh, yes. This is awkward. Anyway, so we're getting everything done.
00:03:29:19 - 00:03:34:10
Kevin
Blood tests, all this kind of stuff. And I'm sitting in the chair and she pokes me in both arms.
00:03:34:13 - 00:03:35:19
Kevin
She couldn't find my fucking vein.
00:03:35:20 - 00:03:41:27
Brandon
After you left to go to the bathroom, she was like, I've never had that happen before. Oh.
00:03:41:29 - 00:03:42:19
Kevin
So that all.
00:03:42:19 - 00:03:48:08
Kevin
Happens. And then she's talking about, okay, here's the cut that you need to print, which by the way, was like this week.
00:03:48:09 - 00:03:51:15
Kevin
It was like I come formal, like I feel like I've had to like.
00:03:51:18 - 00:03:56:11
Brandon
It was a paper cup with a plastic top. It looked like you were going to a bodega and you're.
00:03:56:13 - 00:04:01:03
Kevin
Like, Oh, yeah, like one of those black coffee cups or like if few on.
00:04:01:03 - 00:04:06:16
Kevin
The Upper West Side, there's this delicious restaurant called Malecon and you can get like a chemical and let's say there, and it was like.
00:04:06:16 - 00:04:07:20
Kevin
That was like the.
00:04:07:20 - 00:04:13:22
Kevin
Plastic type that was fucking weird. So she gives that to me and then she's like, And then you'll also have to do this.
00:04:13:24 - 00:04:14:14
Kevin
Rectal.
00:04:14:19 - 00:04:18:11
Kevin
Swab, which you can do on your own. And I went, I'm sorry.
00:04:18:13 - 00:04:19:00
Kevin
Well, over two.
00:04:19:00 - 00:04:20:22
Brandon
Liters, a rectal or anal.
00:04:20:22 - 00:04:21:24
Kevin
She said, one of the two.
00:04:21:27 - 00:04:26:21
Brandon
In there, remember, just like she was in front of me. And I just like with my head up.
00:04:26:21 - 00:04:27:09
Kevin
It was like, what?
00:04:27:11 - 00:04:32:09
Kevin
And I was like, I'm sorry, what? And so she was like, it's it's, you know, for you, you just.
00:04:32:09 - 00:04:33:22
Kevin
You got a.
00:04:33:25 - 00:04:37:06
Kevin
Swab. And I was like, Look, I have to stick that in my ass and swab.
00:04:37:09 - 00:04:43:14
Kevin
And she was like, Yes. And I'm like, What? And so, oh, okay.
00:04:43:14 - 00:04:44:27
Kevin
So I went to the bathroom.
00:04:44:29 - 00:04:45:04
Kevin
And.
00:04:45:04 - 00:04:46:19
Brandon
You were in there a very long.
00:04:46:19 - 00:04:51:02
Kevin
Time. I'm nervous. And then I went to go like, do the pee right in the cup.
00:04:51:02 - 00:04:52:02
Kevin
So I was like, I'll start there.
00:04:52:09 - 00:04:57:18
Kevin
So I like first off, I took my pants all the way down so it looks like peeing with my pants and like, you were a.
00:04:57:18 - 00:04:59:24
Brandon
Child, a little girl.
00:04:59:27 - 00:05:02:01
Kevin
But anyway, I'm going to do that.
00:05:02:03 - 00:05:03:04
Kevin
And I go, you know.
00:05:03:07 - 00:05:11:02
Kevin
You know what? Your dick out, like, whatever. And then the cup falls into the toilet. I hadn't peed in the and I was like, gross So hopefully somebody else.
00:05:11:02 - 00:05:12:05
Brandon
Had flushed before that.
00:05:12:05 - 00:05:14:12
Kevin
I mean, it didn't look like anything but ill, right?
00:05:14:12 - 00:05:14:28
Brandon
It's gross.
00:05:14:28 - 00:05:16:26
Kevin
Still. So I had to, like, rinse off the cup and all that.
00:05:17:00 - 00:05:18:13
Brandon
Was there anything inside the cup?
00:05:18:18 - 00:05:19:01
Kevin
No, I.
00:05:19:01 - 00:05:19:18
Kevin
Hadn't peed in it.
00:05:19:23 - 00:05:20:02
Kevin
No, but.
00:05:20:02 - 00:05:20:14
Brandon
Like, did.
00:05:20:14 - 00:05:21:19
Kevin
Toilet water get one.
00:05:21:19 - 00:05:22:19
Kevin
Hundred percent?
00:05:22:21 - 00:05:28:07
Kevin
Like, would there be contamination with that? I don't know. I rinsed it. Whatever I dried at all with the with the.
00:05:28:07 - 00:05:30:02
Kevin
Brown gross paper towels that were.
00:05:30:04 - 00:05:31:07
Kevin
And then.
00:05:31:09 - 00:05:39:00
Kevin
Peed in that. And then here's the thing. I was like, okay, let me try to swab my own asshole.
00:05:39:02 - 00:05:40:01
Brandon
It was such an uncomfortable.
00:05:40:04 - 00:05:44:03
Kevin
It was awful. So I'm trying to literally I was just taking that fucking.
00:05:44:07 - 00:05:46:17
Kevin
Like basically COVID. It was like, yeah, it.
00:05:46:17 - 00:05:48:18
Brandon
Was a COVID test for your booty hole.
00:05:48:20 - 00:05:49:18
Kevin
And it was like the.
00:05:49:18 - 00:05:50:10
Kevin
Same thing too.
00:05:50:10 - 00:05:52:18
Brandon
So it was you're taking the dry cotton swab.
00:05:52:18 - 00:05:53:29
Kevin
It was awful putting it in.
00:05:54:03 - 00:05:56:05
Brandon
And she literally she showed me and she.
00:05:56:05 - 00:05:57:18
Kevin
Was just So do you. She did not show me. No.
00:05:57:18 - 00:06:01:15
Brandon
She's like, You want to take it? And then you want to scrub the lining inside.
00:06:01:15 - 00:06:06:18
Kevin
And I was like, I don't want to do that. Okay, listen, I was like, sticking it.
00:06:06:18 - 00:06:08:25
Kevin
All sorts of places and I couldn't get in my hole.
00:06:08:27 - 00:06:10:16
Kevin
So to take my phone out.
00:06:10:19 - 00:06:13:14
Kevin
Put the camera on, put it down, bend down to look at my own ass.
00:06:13:19 - 00:06:23:03
Kevin
Stick this shit. And I got it in. I just went boop, boop. There was no swabbing. And I'm telling you, I was like, ill. It was disgusting. Fucking awful. It was discussing.
00:06:23:08 - 00:06:25:16
Kevin
Anyway, so. So you've had to swipe your own asshole.
00:06:25:16 - 00:06:26:20
Kevin
Please leave a review.
00:06:26:20 - 00:06:28:18
Kevin
With a five star review and.
00:06:28:20 - 00:06:29:24
Brandon
I guarantee you it'll be.
00:06:29:24 - 00:06:33:02
Kevin
Mostly all gay men. 100%. Well, because it.
00:06:33:02 - 00:06:49:18
Brandon
Was technically for I'm pretty sure that was for the SD screening. And we are. We're monogamous. Yeah, we don't. We don't ever we don't typically test for STDs because we don't do anything. And so we were like, Do you want us to do it as deadpan? Oh, we said, Sure, why not? We haven't done it in forever, so let's do it.
00:06:49:25 - 00:06:55:00
Brandon
So I'm pretty sure that was just part of the the SCD screening, which.
00:06:55:02 - 00:06:55:27
Kevin
I was.
00:06:55:27 - 00:07:00:08
Brandon
Not aware of. I feel like the last time we did the SCD screening, it was just blood.
00:07:00:08 - 00:07:00:23
Kevin
I don't.
00:07:00:26 - 00:07:05:01
Brandon
Know. I don't remember anything. I don't remember having to do anything to myself.
00:07:05:01 - 00:07:05:11
Kevin
Well, and some.
00:07:05:11 - 00:07:07:10
Kevin
People talk about how they, like swab inside of.
00:07:07:10 - 00:07:11:27
Kevin
Your urine, Aretha Oh, and all that kind of stuff. And that I've never had. No, But I feel like.
00:07:11:27 - 00:07:16:21
Brandon
That's probably if you have something and they have to, like give you give your parents something out.
00:07:16:23 - 00:07:25:24
Kevin
Like if you have gonorrhea and you're like, oh, and it's like, oh, okay, so shooting out of your dick anyways, anyway, I have never had.
00:07:25:26 - 00:07:26:26
Kevin
I've had several friends that were.
00:07:26:26 - 00:07:29:15
Kevin
Like, Devon, I have gonorrhea and I'm like.
00:07:29:15 - 00:07:30:02
Kevin
Oh, tell me.
00:07:30:02 - 00:07:31:07
Kevin
Everything. Right?
00:07:31:09 - 00:07:33:05
Brandon
Tell me, don't show me, tell me like that.
00:07:33:05 - 00:07:36:26
Kevin
Like, remember, um. Body. Yeah. Yeah. Not my.
00:07:36:26 - 00:07:37:09
Kevin
Brother in law.
00:07:37:09 - 00:07:40:11
Kevin
But somebody that I used to work with. And he just.
00:07:40:11 - 00:07:41:11
Kevin
Told me everything. And I was like.
00:07:41:11 - 00:07:45:26
Kevin
It's in your mouth, you know? Yeah, but when we.
00:07:45:26 - 00:07:46:29
Brandon
U.S. friends.
00:07:46:29 - 00:07:49:09
Kevin
Yes. When we posted it on social media a whole bunch.
00:07:49:09 - 00:07:51:15
Kevin
I think most of the game friends. Oh, all.
00:07:51:15 - 00:07:52:19
Brandon
Of the gay men that we know.
00:07:52:21 - 00:07:53:07
Kevin
Tend to do that.
00:07:53:07 - 00:07:54:28
Brandon
And I'm like, we're starting to, right? Yes, I.
00:07:54:28 - 00:07:55:23
Kevin
Have. Yeah.
00:07:55:25 - 00:07:58:02
Kevin
Anyway, so swabbing assholes, that is.
00:07:58:05 - 00:08:00:16
Brandon
And then other people are like, you might have malpractice.
00:08:00:18 - 00:08:02:27
Kevin
I know. I think that's right. Where they're hidden.
00:08:02:27 - 00:08:03:28
Kevin
Cameras. I'm like, they're.
00:08:03:29 - 00:08:04:19
Kevin
Killing.
00:08:04:22 - 00:08:07:06
Kevin
Whatever. I mean, I would watch that because it was really funny.
00:08:07:09 - 00:08:08:28
Kevin
Yeah, I'm not going to lie. Like, yeah, that.
00:08:08:28 - 00:08:10:17
Kevin
Whole situation for me was very it.
00:08:10:17 - 00:08:14:20
Brandon
Was hilarious just because it cut us off guard. And when something like.
00:08:14:23 - 00:08:23:07
Kevin
I mean, and I'm awkward and I'm like, I'm sorry, you want me to stick that to my asshole? And she you could tell that she was like, yeah, like, yeah, you're welcome. Well, then you walked away.
00:08:23:07 - 00:08:29:14
Brandon
But there is a other guy who walked up to the doorway and said something like, Well, that's a common occurrence here. Oh.
00:08:29:16 - 00:08:31:14
Kevin
I mean, like we even said.
00:08:31:14 - 00:08:39:20
Brandon
On the ticktock, I'm like, It's one thing to hand a grown person your urine in a cup, but having to hand it over a tube that has.
00:08:39:20 - 00:08:45:10
Kevin
A swab of your anal inside of it, it was so.
00:08:45:10 - 00:08:46:03
Brandon
Uncomfortable.
00:08:46:03 - 00:08:46:18
Kevin
And we had an.
00:08:46:18 - 00:08:48:15
Kevin
Unfortunate morning with some food.
00:08:48:15 - 00:08:52:18
Kevin
It's like, well, we had Taco Bell the night before. We did not think about it. So I'm.
00:08:52:18 - 00:08:54:28
Kevin
Like, here's my you know.
00:08:55:02 - 00:08:56:21
Brandon
You're welcome. I'm sorry I'm leaving.
00:08:56:28 - 00:09:03:28
Kevin
But please don't look me in the eye. You know. Anyway, so yeah.
00:09:03:28 - 00:09:06:08
Kevin
We started the New Year with an anal swab.
00:09:06:10 - 00:09:12:09
Kevin
Anal swabbing after two years of having our own anus. Yeah. Yeah, we violated ourselves. Yeah, that was a.
00:09:12:09 - 00:09:13:14
Brandon
Dry swab.
00:09:13:17 - 00:09:15:03
Kevin
And I could never, like, I'd.
00:09:15:04 - 00:09:19:06
Kevin
Clearly, I'm gay. I've stuck several things up my ass, but I definitely don't.
00:09:19:09 - 00:09:26:21
Kevin
I. I could not get this. I was getting hot in here. We said we should plug in that hole.
00:09:26:23 - 00:09:31:09
Brandon
Haven't you missed listening to Homicide's the podcast with your friends, Kevin and Brandon?
00:09:31:09 - 00:09:34:21
Kevin
Maybe not. Anyway, we may gain followers.
00:09:34:21 - 00:09:35:23
Brandon
We may lose followers.
00:09:35:23 - 00:09:36:28
Kevin
But.
00:09:37:01 - 00:09:37:20
Brandon
There you go.
00:09:37:20 - 00:09:41:26
Kevin
Story of our life. But anyway, happy New Year. It's a happy New Year. Happy Christmas.
00:09:42:03 - 00:09:49:28
Kevin
Holiday. And however you celebrate, we are non-religious people. So it's all about Christmas trees and Santa Clauses and chocolate.
00:09:50:00 - 00:09:50:23
Kevin
And.
00:09:50:25 - 00:09:52:17
Kevin
Everything that's not related to.
00:09:52:18 - 00:10:00:02
Kevin
Jesus Christ. It's good for those who do. He's the reason for the season. Keep Jesus Christ and Christmas.
00:10:00:04 - 00:10:00:24
Brandon
Thank you for that.
00:10:01:01 - 00:10:03:10
Kevin
You're welcome. Anyway, beautiful. Uh.
00:10:03:13 - 00:10:05:04
Kevin
If you believe in all that.
00:10:05:07 - 00:10:11:20
Kevin
I, I Great. Okay. So, Brandon, Homicide. Yes. Is that who.
00:10:11:20 - 00:10:13:18
Brandon
Is ready for episode ten?
00:10:13:20 - 00:10:17:03
Kevin
I am, but Brandon. Oh, Omar's okay. This week we.
00:10:17:03 - 00:10:20:01
Kevin
Have episode ten coming up on Tuesday, but then on.
00:10:20:01 - 00:10:22:16
Kevin
Thursday. Oh, yes, we.
00:10:22:16 - 00:10:24:14
Kevin
Have our next homo.
00:10:24:14 - 00:10:26:07
Kevin
Town and it's been a bit for.
00:10:26:07 - 00:10:28:11
Kevin
That. Yes, but we're also doing something kind of fun. Yeah, we're.
00:10:28:11 - 00:10:38:03
Brandon
Switching it up. Yeah. We decided after the last one that we did with Brian that we're going to do it a little bit different. So preemptively, I want to say, Brian, I know you're listening.
00:10:38:06 - 00:10:38:29
Kevin
So if you want to send in.
00:10:38:29 - 00:10:44:27
Brandon
Another hometown murder you, we will have you back on. We'll have your story back.
00:10:44:27 - 00:10:47:07
Kevin
I like how he preemptively says, I know. I just fucked it up.
00:10:47:07 - 00:10:52:11
Brandon
You're welcome. Anyway, it's. Go ahead. Okay. I'm trying to do in a different way, and then I just. Yeah, I ruined it going.
00:10:52:11 - 00:10:53:15
Kevin
We'll jump back to that.
00:10:53:15 - 00:10:55:11
Kevin
But anyway, our hometown.
00:10:55:11 - 00:11:02:17
Kevin
Murders. First off, if you have a hometown murder, which is your hometown murder, but we're homo side. So Homo murder, we're.
00:11:02:18 - 00:11:03:08
Brandon
We're I guess.
00:11:03:08 - 00:11:13:21
Kevin
Yes, I guess. Send in your hometown murderer to us at murder at Homicide podcast dot com again, Murder at Homicide podcast, HMO. Send that into us. And then what.
00:11:13:21 - 00:11:17:23
Kevin
We're going to do in this new year is we want you to.
00:11:17:23 - 00:11:19:21
Kevin
Tell your hometown, we.
00:11:19:21 - 00:11:22:08
Kevin
Do with us. And so you basically will.
00:11:22:08 - 00:11:24:29
Kevin
Do all the work, the research, whatever, and come to the.
00:11:24:29 - 00:11:27:14
Kevin
Table and join us.
00:11:27:17 - 00:11:33:21
Kevin
Recording on the podcast. Yeah, telling the story. We will be in there just gagging.
00:11:33:26 - 00:11:34:26
Brandon
You tell us and we.
00:11:34:26 - 00:11:35:13
Kevin
React.
00:11:35:16 - 00:11:37:10
Kevin
Reacting because, you know.
00:11:37:12 - 00:11:40:01
Brandon
These are now, instead of us telling you the story, you tell us.
00:11:40:02 - 00:11:40:11
Kevin
Correct.
00:11:40:14 - 00:11:44:21
Brandon
So again. Brian Yeah. If you said in another story, we'll have you on the podcast this time.
00:11:44:22 - 00:11:45:18
Kevin
Yes. So, so.
00:11:45:18 - 00:11:48:17
Kevin
This week is featuring my really good friend.
00:11:48:17 - 00:11:49:19
Kevin
Matty. Yeah.
00:11:49:26 - 00:11:52:17
Kevin
And I'm super excited for you to join her cause, man.
00:11:52:20 - 00:11:53:11
Kevin
To join her.
00:11:53:14 - 00:11:55:25
Brandon
Join me for her to join us. For you to hear her.
00:11:55:25 - 00:12:02:25
Kevin
Yes, for you to join us. Listening or watching when Matty joins us this week.
00:12:02:25 - 00:12:06:27
Kevin
So anyway, I'm really excited, excited for you.
00:12:06:29 - 00:12:09:03
Kevin
And us and everyone in between.
00:12:09:03 - 00:12:10:14
Kevin
Anyway.
00:12:10:16 - 00:12:15:04
Kevin
And then episode 11 comes out the next week, so really excited to be back on track. We'll let you know more.
00:12:15:04 - 00:12:17:11
Kevin
About the.
00:12:17:14 - 00:12:24:19
Kevin
Giveaway that we're doing. So just remember, please subscribe on YouTube, follow us on wherever you listen to your podcast.
00:12:24:19 - 00:12:29:07
Kevin
But specifically, um, Apple, Apple Podcasts.
00:12:29:07 - 00:12:31:23
Kevin
And Spotify and all of them anyway.
00:12:31:23 - 00:12:32:11
Kevin
Specifically.
00:12:32:11 - 00:12:33:19
Brandon
Those two, but then all of them that.
00:12:33:19 - 00:12:36:21
Kevin
Makes sure. And then also please.
00:12:36:21 - 00:12:48:03
Kevin
Rate and review. Yeah, five stars that always helps us grow. So anyway, God, that was a lot. Your what was the one? If you don't like listening to intros, just maybe fast forward by 15.
00:12:48:03 - 00:13:04:04
Kevin
Or 20 minutes and you'll be there. So Brendan says Episode ten is titled Tell us, Tell us a kid, Stay away. Hey, could stay away. Hey, kid, let me just. What do you mean by Jacob? Just kidding.
00:13:04:04 - 00:13:06:27
Kevin
So today's episode is all about killer children.
00:13:07:00 - 00:13:09:22
Kevin
Terrifying by the way. It's fucking scary.
00:13:09:22 - 00:13:13:21
Brandon
It is terrifying. It's like. Like imagine a like a toddler with a knife chasing you.
00:13:13:21 - 00:13:14:27
Kevin
That's terrifying.
00:13:14:29 - 00:13:16:19
Kevin
That reminds me of, like, Chucky.
00:13:16:21 - 00:13:17:00
Kevin
Right?
00:13:17:06 - 00:13:18:26
Kevin
Even though he was not the child.
00:13:18:29 - 00:13:20:21
Kevin
Basically. That's still. Yeah. I feel like.
00:13:20:21 - 00:13:32:17
Brandon
There's nothing more terrifying than a child who is capable of killing, whether they understand what they're doing or they're not. Like it's terrifying. You've barely experienced, experienced sirens.
00:13:32:20 - 00:13:32:28
Kevin
Okay.
00:13:32:28 - 00:13:40:29
Kevin
Jumping back to Chucky. We know. Is that Chucky? No, I'm. I got was thinking about the leprechaun. Have you seen the movie Leprechaun?
00:13:41:00 - 00:13:42:06
Brandon
Yeah, but I don't remember. It was.
00:13:42:06 - 00:13:44:11
Kevin
Oh, my God. We. I watched all.
00:13:44:11 - 00:13:45:25
Brandon
Of you talk about it every Halloween, but we.
00:13:45:25 - 00:13:46:06
Kevin
Mostly.
00:13:46:09 - 00:13:56:00
Kevin
Talk about leprechaun in the hood. It is really fucking funny anyway. But. Leprechaun? Yeah. Why did they bring that one? Oh, my God. Is it. Did you ever see the movie Willow?
00:13:56:03 - 00:13:57:05
Kevin
Yeah, I think so.
00:13:57:05 - 00:14:00:16
Kevin
If you came back, I don't know. It's like.
00:14:00:18 - 00:14:02:19
Brandon
You're asking me to remember Way too many references right.
00:14:02:19 - 00:14:05:07
Kevin
Now. Oh, I know. Chucky Leprechaun. Well, sure.
00:14:05:10 - 00:14:11:17
Kevin
That the same actor played the leprechaun as played Willow, who was also in Harry Potter.
00:14:11:20 - 00:14:13:11
Kevin
Okay.
00:14:13:13 - 00:14:13:26
Brandon
Where are we.
00:14:13:26 - 00:14:14:12
Kevin
Going with.
00:14:14:12 - 00:14:15:27
Brandon
This? We're talking about killer children.
00:14:15:27 - 00:14:33:26
Kevin
Anyway, let's jump back to Killer children. Why didn't you see any of that? Was the play? I don't know what you're welcome for all of it. So we'll talk about it later tonight after we've smoked them. All right. It'll be like, okay, why did you even bring that up? I don't know. You're welcome for it, though, anyway, so.
00:14:33:27 - 00:14:38:11
Kevin
Hey, kid, stay away. Episode ten Killer Children. Brandon, are.
00:14:38:11 - 00:14:39:09
Kevin
You ready for.
00:14:39:09 - 00:14:44:27
Brandon
My turn to go first? We definitely had to double check the YouTube channel to see what our less who spoke first last time.
00:14:44:27 - 00:14:46:28
Kevin
But it was you. So it's me. Me, then.
00:14:47:01 - 00:14:47:14
Brandon
You ready?
00:14:47:14 - 00:14:48:19
Kevin
Yeah. Yes.
00:14:48:19 - 00:14:49:22
Brandon
Girls, do it.
00:14:49:22 - 00:14:50:20
Kevin
Tell us.
00:14:50:23 - 00:14:53:08
Brandon
So I don't have a title for mine.
00:14:53:10 - 00:14:53:24
Kevin
Oh.
00:14:53:26 - 00:15:07:12
Brandon
But I just looked up one of the news article headlines, which is kind of interesting, so I'm going to use that as my headline. And it is When the Face of Evil is 13, A Small Towns Pain is the title of the article.
00:15:07:15 - 00:15:08:13
Kevin
That made no sense.
00:15:08:19 - 00:15:10:05
Brandon
Why you'll read it.
00:15:10:07 - 00:15:12:21
Kevin
I'll tell you the story. No, no. But read it again.
00:15:12:23 - 00:15:18:23
Brandon
When the face of evil is 13, a small towns pain.
00:15:18:25 - 00:15:20:24
Kevin
That makes no sense. It's it's.
00:15:21:02 - 00:15:22:23
Brandon
It's Cole. It's like two separate.
00:15:22:26 - 00:15:26:01
Kevin
Pieces, but. Oh, just. This is why I.
00:15:26:01 - 00:15:27:07
Brandon
Don't do this shit.
00:15:27:10 - 00:15:31:29
Kevin
That would have been something to. I should. I should have just.
00:15:31:29 - 00:15:34:06
Brandon
Said, I don't have a title. Let me go into it.
00:15:34:06 - 00:15:35:28
Kevin
So I don't have a title. Let me just dive right.
00:15:35:28 - 00:15:39:04
Kevin
Here was this and who was the author? Because that was bad choices.
00:15:39:06 - 00:15:41:17
Brandon
I'm sorry. It might make sense after I read it.
00:15:41:17 - 00:15:42:21
Kevin
All right, well, let's dive in.
00:15:42:22 - 00:16:14:01
Brandon
All right. So it was a normal day on August 2nd, 1993, in Savona, New York. Derek, Joseph, Robbie, a bright and lively four year old boy, was waiting to leave the house to go to the park where he was on a recreational baseball team. Being that they were only a block away from the park, it was a common occurrence for Derek to walk on his own as his mother, Doreen, Doreen, Robbie watched from the house, distracted by Derek's younger brother, Dalton.
00:16:14:03 - 00:16:30:20
Brandon
He was a bit fidgety and Doreen had her hands full, taking care of him that day, trying to help. Derek told Doreen his mother that he would be all right and that he can make it all by himself, that it would be no problem knowing that was it was only a short distance. It was only a block away.
00:16:30:23 - 00:16:52:09
Brandon
It was on a dead end street with no cross streets, and that he knew his way around. Since they go there so often, Doreen decided that he was capable of going on his own for the very first time with this boy, with his packed lens in hand, a kiss in the mutual exchange of I love you, Derek. When hopping off the sidewalk, escorted by Doreen to the media.
00:16:52:11 - 00:17:16:11
Brandon
A short time later, around 11 a.m., storm clouds rolled in and it started to downpour, enduring. I started to get a little this weird feeling like something wasn't right. So with the feeling of uneasiness, Uneasiness? I don't know. I just said Doreen went over to the park to get Derek when she got there and talked to the people that were there, she was told that Derek never arrived that morning.
00:17:16:13 - 00:17:22:03
Kevin
Oh, yeah, just what little block away. So one block. Yes. He was going one block.
00:17:22:06 - 00:17:28:06
Brandon
He was walking one block. He's usually watching them because yeah, it was the easy mistake. I think.
00:17:28:08 - 00:17:28:29
Kevin
I mean one block.
00:17:29:03 - 00:17:45:17
Brandon
It was a block where they it's a dent in road. It's where they live. They didn't think anything would happen. Why would you? Right. Yeah. So from there, panic set in. Police were called in understanding the severity of a four year old who was only going a block that went missing. The police and community started searching for him.
00:17:45:20 - 00:17:53:15
Brandon
5 hours later, the body of Derek was found in a small patch of woods right next to the park. So right in between the park and where he lived.
00:17:53:16 - 00:17:54:24
Kevin
A little terror.
00:17:54:27 - 00:18:18:03
Brandon
But what happened immediately, the local community started to panic. Savannah bats right up to the Interstate 86. So thinking it could be someone from out of town who murdered Derek, The town ultimately came to a halt. Parents were scared to let their children out of the house and the police. A search for the killer proceeded. And then at this point, the community of seven had no idea what was about to unfold.
00:18:18:03 - 00:18:43:01
Brandon
Yeah, so here enters Eric Smith, a 13 year old boy who lived on the other side of town, who is also who also attended the same baseball program from images of Eric. He seems like a typical young 13 year old boy. His family at one point described him as fun loving a young boy who liked to clown around and liked attention so adorned with bright red hair.
00:18:43:03 - 00:18:54:06
Brandon
This one is interesting. Lowe set ears, and if you look at his photo, we'll put it on the on our social media. His ears were kind of low. Do the.
00:18:54:09 - 00:18:55:09
Kevin
Right thing.
00:18:55:09 - 00:19:16:17
Brandon
Though. He had really thick glasses and freckles which there's some photos where he kind of looked like an adorable little kid, but then you'd start to hear about him. You're like, oh, so he was. The sad part is that he was often bullied in school and was commonly seen alone because of his his hair, his ears, his glasses.
00:19:16:17 - 00:19:18:08
Brandon
He just didn't really fit in with people.
00:19:18:10 - 00:19:19:10
Kevin
Have a lot of parallels.
00:19:19:10 - 00:19:20:14
Kevin
In our stories today.
00:19:20:16 - 00:19:22:05
Brandon
Maybe we had mentioned it was the same one.
00:19:22:09 - 00:19:23:29
Kevin
That's not it's.
00:19:24:01 - 00:19:50:19
Brandon
Riding his bike, so he would commonly be seen alone, riding his bike all over town with no one with him. It many considered him a loner. A few days after the murder, people started to notice that Eric was starting to act a little differently. A family friend named Marlene Haskell even came out to say that Eric came to her and a neighbor, a man asked her what would happen if it turned out to be a kid like who murdered him.
00:19:50:19 - 00:19:51:00
Kevin
Oh, that's.
00:19:51:00 - 00:19:59:13
Brandon
Interesting. Which seems like an odd question. And paired with the additional questions about DNA evidence and some other stuff. What year was this? 1993.
00:19:59:14 - 00:20:00:06
Kevin
Okay. All right.
00:20:00:12 - 00:20:22:11
Brandon
It's even quoted that Eric's grandfather knew that he was hiding something. He said in a it was like a 48 hour episode. In no way did we feel that he had done it. So he felt that he knew something. Maybe somebody had threatened him. That's why he wouldn't tell him. So knowing that he was at the park that day as well.
00:20:22:11 - 00:20:42:07
Brandon
Marlene suspicions were kind of going a little crazy. So thinking that he may actually know something, he called Eric's mother, Tammy Smith. And they and Tammy decided to take Eric to the police to meet with the investigators to maybe get him to talk about whatever happened. So when Eric started talking to the investigators, they were surprised with how interested in the murder he was.
00:20:42:09 - 00:20:48:06
Brandon
He talked about it as if he really enjoyed talking about it. And then he was acting pretty upbeat and happy.
00:20:48:08 - 00:20:49:03
Kevin
Which is just.
00:20:49:06 - 00:20:50:28
Brandon
Kind of creepy because the children are fucking.
00:20:50:28 - 00:20:52:27
Kevin
Creepy.
00:20:52:29 - 00:20:55:00
Brandon
Even children who do murder are creepy sometimes.
00:20:55:05 - 00:20:55:23
Kevin
Yeah.
00:20:55:26 - 00:21:16:28
Brandon
The investigator, John Hess, was also quoted as saying he looked he's looking right at me. He's very upbeat, very happy. He likes the fact that he's being talked to, which is also creepy, but also thinking like this loner kid who has really no friends. He's excited to talk to somebody, which it's talking about murder, which is also creepy.
00:21:16:28 - 00:21:40:23
Brandon
It's just weird. So at first, Eric said that he hadn't seen Derek that day, but abruptly he changed his story. He told them that he was riding his bike across right across from the open field, and he saw him wearing a white t shirt and carrying a lunch bag. Investigators are a bit surprised by the answer because they happened to because it happened to be the same exact spot where his body was found.
00:21:40:25 - 00:21:47:25
Brandon
So he's saying he saw Derek in the field where the body was found on the other side of the park with his bike.
00:21:48:02 - 00:21:48:21
Kevin
Oh, goodness.
00:21:48:21 - 00:22:14:02
Brandon
Yeah. So after a bit more questioning, Eric was starting to get visibly upset. Even once he curled his hands in fists by his face and asked if they thought he killed Derek. So if you're watching, he from what I saw, it was it was the investigator. He had his hands up like this and he was shaking his fist by his face and he got mad and he said, like out of anger, said, do you think do you think that I killed him?
00:22:14:05 - 00:22:16:21
Brandon
Which is creepy. And children are.
00:22:16:23 - 00:22:18:00
Kevin
Going to.
00:22:18:03 - 00:22:43:09
Brandon
Right now, Maybe, possibly so. The next day, on August 6th, the police took Eric to the location where Derek where he saw Derek glassed with a video camera in hand. They had Eric reenact his day, which I watched. And it's really it's kind of creepy because he's very calm. So as calm as ever in this video. You can see Eric doing as they ask, riding his bike up and down the street as if nothing happened.
00:22:43:11 - 00:23:03:19
Brandon
He doesn't look panicked. He doesn't look anything. He's just like calmly, collectively showing them. So, however, it was very clear to investigators that something wasn't right, that the information Eric gave them the day before didn't match what they saw, that it was it was not possible for Eric to actually see Derek where he said he would from the street.
00:23:03:19 - 00:23:27:21
Brandon
But from here, the police couldn't really do anything as they didn't have enough evidence to prove anything. So they were they just let him off and go because they were like, we don't really know. We don't know anything. So then then comes August 8th. So again, this all started August 2nd. So a few days later, on August 8th, I'm not sure why and I couldn't really see anywhere why like what prompted any of this.
00:23:27:21 - 00:23:53:03
Brandon
But Eric was at home with his family and he started to break down. So for some reason or not, he broke down in one and his grandfather was quoted to say that while they were at the house, Eric said, I'm sorry, mom, I'm sorry I killed that little boy. Right. They immediately started questioning him. Why? You know what he's talking about, what he did, how he did it, why they did it.
00:23:53:05 - 00:23:55:20
Brandon
But eventually they brought him to the police station.
00:23:55:20 - 00:23:56:12
Kevin
I mean. Yeah.
00:23:56:13 - 00:24:09:25
Brandon
Which kudos to the parents, I would say, because there's a lot of parents that I feel like would not do that they would try to hide it emotionally and try to be like, No, my kid wouldn't do this. But to me, this is I think they did the right thing to bring their child.
00:24:10:01 - 00:24:10:26
Kevin
You absolutely would have.
00:24:10:26 - 00:24:11:17
Kevin
Done the same thing.
00:24:11:21 - 00:24:19:23
Brandon
Yeah. So on August 9th, local authorities announced that Eric Smith, Eric Smith was arrested for the murder of Derrick, Robyn.
00:24:19:24 - 00:24:24:00
Kevin
Eric Smith. So what happens? Right, Yeah.
00:24:24:01 - 00:24:43:01
Brandon
So from an I almost put this piece in the beginning, but I'm like, let me move it down. It's not too crazy. It's a little bit hard, but it's not too hard. So from what I saw in my research, many sources believed he killed Derek because of all of the bullying he encountered in his life. It made him angry and he found someone to take it out on.
00:24:43:03 - 00:25:12:21
Brandon
He was also quoted in saying, I don't know. I just saw this kid, this blond kid, and I wanted to hurt him, which is terrifying. Again, children are terrifying. So evidence in Eric's testimony in the murder helped paint the picture of what happened. Yeah. So first, Eric saw Derek while he was riding on his bike, and he lured him into the woods, and immediately Eric started to strangle him, like, in it.
00:25:12:23 - 00:25:33:16
Brandon
Like, from what I saw, everything happened very quickly. Once Derek was unconscious, Eric looked around to see if there was anything I would assume as a weapon to use as a weapon. So he saw some big rocks in the ground next to him. So he dug them up. He dug up one pretty large rock, which was pretty, pretty big compared to him.
00:25:33:16 - 00:25:40:17
Brandon
Yeah. And then a smaller one. And Eric took the rocks and started to bludgeon Derek with them until he was dead.
00:25:40:20 - 00:25:43:23
Kevin
So he had simply strangled them and passed them. He passed out.
00:25:43:27 - 00:25:45:22
Kevin
In the he and then he beat the shit out of.
00:25:45:22 - 00:26:13:25
Brandon
Him with rocks. Yeah, but it doesn't really stop there. Okay, so grabbing Derek's lunch bag, he grabbed the bottle of Kool aid he had for some reason and dumped it into all of the wounds of Derek's body. Again, don't know why. Fuckin weird, creepy and then the worst part to me is that he then for some reason took a stick and sodomized Derek with it.
00:26:13:28 - 00:26:15:17
Kevin
Okay.
00:26:15:20 - 00:26:20:14
Brandon
Again, there's no reason. And then again. And I have and then for some reason I.
00:26:20:14 - 00:26:21:02
Kevin
Feel is a.
00:26:21:02 - 00:26:33:21
Brandon
Few times Eric took a banana out of the lunch bag and smashed it, removed both shoes, put his right shoe by his left hand, in his left shoe by his right hand, as if he was posing him.
00:26:33:24 - 00:26:38:28
Kevin
And then left. Oh yeah.
00:26:39:00 - 00:26:46:04
Brandon
Oh, fucking weird. So on September 2nd, Eric was indicted by a grand jury on a second degree murder charge.
00:26:46:11 - 00:26:47:14
Kevin
Sorry, that was second.
00:26:47:16 - 00:26:52:25
Brandon
Yeah. And he would be tried as an adult because in New York, a child can be tried as an adult.
00:26:52:27 - 00:26:54:15
Kevin
And he was held as if there were 13.
00:26:54:15 - 00:26:55:04
Brandon
He was 13.
00:26:55:07 - 00:26:56:04
Kevin
Of the fuck was a teenager.
00:26:56:04 - 00:27:28:20
Brandon
Yeah. So. Yeah, well, he obviously pleaded guilty. I'm sorry. He pleaded not guilty to it. Because people do that. Yeah, because they want to get away with murder, sir. So then a year later, after the murder on August of 1994, the trial began, Eric's attorney argued that he suffered from mental. He suffers from a mental disease that can be characterized as rage disorder, which was quoted from him in in the rages order was called intermittent explosive disorder.
00:27:28:23 - 00:27:42:08
Brandon
Yes, his mom and stepdad got on the stand and told the jury that Eric would have tantrums and being his head on the floor as he had speech problems and he would come home and say how stupid he was and that sometimes he just wanted to hurt somebody.
00:27:42:11 - 00:27:43:26
Kevin
Oh well.
00:27:43:28 - 00:28:09:03
Brandon
Yeah, they all stated that because he had this disorder, he shouldn't be held criminally responsible for the murder. The prosecution argued that he knew exactly what he was doing. They noted that his rage disorder is that rage disorder in general is rare and rarely seen in children his age. They believe to that he analyzed the situation and then he decided to take action and he knew exactly what he wanted to do.
00:28:09:06 - 00:28:28:18
Brandon
At one point before the trial, both sides did medical tests on Eric to try to prove the disorder, to prove or deny the disorder. They examined his brain function, his hormone levels and a bunch of other things. And ultimately there was no concrete evidence that there was anything mentally wrong with Eric. However, his attorney still believed that it was true.
00:28:28:20 - 00:28:29:06
Kevin
Yeah.
00:28:29:08 - 00:28:50:26
Brandon
So on August 16th, 1994, a few hours after deliberation, the jury reached a verdict. The jury agreed with the prosecution and believes Eric could have controlled his action. And he was found guilty of second degree murder at the age of 13 years old. So while in jail, Eric wrote an apology letter to the Derek's family and read it on public television.
00:28:50:26 - 00:29:17:21
Brandon
And it said, I know my actions have caused terrible loss in the Ravi family, and for that, I am truly sorry. I've tried to think as much as possible about what Derek will never experience his 16th birthday, Christmas at any time, owning his own house, graduating, going to college, getting married, his first child. If I could go back in time, I would switch places with Derek and endure all of the pain I've caused him.
00:29:17:24 - 00:29:33:26
Brandon
If it meant that he would go on living, I'd switch places, but I can't. So on November 7th, Eric was sentenced to the maximum sentence of nine years to life. Which nine years seems low, but I think that's the maximum sentence for somebody of his.
00:29:33:29 - 00:29:38:02
Kevin
Okay, so I'm not going to lie. Sometimes I don't understand what nine years to life means.
00:29:38:02 - 00:29:46:19
Brandon
Meaning he has to at least serve nine years than after nine years he's put up for parole and he can potentially get out.
00:29:46:21 - 00:29:46:29
Kevin
Of it.
00:29:47:03 - 00:30:09:20
Brandon
But he could potentially stay for the rest of his life. So it's basically they're saying you may or may not get back out it so he would serve his time in juvenile detention until he turned 21 and then he'd be transferred to an adult prison. But we're not done. So on June 11th, 2024, Eric was 22 and it was nine years and he was up for parole.
00:30:09:24 - 00:30:10:11
Kevin
Wow.
00:30:10:13 - 00:30:28:12
Brandon
So the parole board, The parole board. I'm actually really proud that that's like one of the first times I didn't have it locked up that much so far. Sorry, guys, to get rid of it at this time, but I'll probably mess up a bunch time. So the parole board noted that he showed little remorse for what he did and they denied his release.
00:30:28:15 - 00:30:39:26
Brandon
And then two years later, he tried again and he was named denied. Then two years later, after that, he tried again and he was denied. Overall, Eric was denied parole ten times.
00:30:39:26 - 00:30:43:22
Kevin
Wow. Yeah. And do they come apart for parole every year?
00:30:43:25 - 00:30:59:15
Brandon
I think for him, it it for him, a lot of it was every two years. Okay. So I don't know if if it's determined or if there's a set, that's probably something we should look at. But he went for every two years. So then on October 5th, 2021, we're getting close.
00:30:59:18 - 00:31:01:24
Kevin
And he's not much.
00:31:01:26 - 00:31:06:27
Kevin
Older than we are. No, he's not. Yeah.
00:31:07:00 - 00:31:38:26
Brandon
So. So on October 5th, 2021, Eric Eric had his 11th parole board hearing in this time was a little bit different. After talking about his remorse, his desire to obtain a college degree, and how he recently got engaged to a woman who was studying to be a lawyer and wrote about him. I wrote about the juvenile justice system and more things shifted a bit and he talked about like wanting to follow the American Dream, which I thought was pretty interesting.
00:31:38:27 - 00:32:03:01
Brandon
Yeah. So on October 7th, his parole was granted as the board believed, that they'd seen him change over the years in that he does not seem to be a threat to society anymore. So after being locked up for 28 years, Eric was released from prison prison at the age of 42 on February 1st, 2022. And so when that happened, the community got a little bit worried.
00:32:03:08 - 00:32:26:27
Brandon
Yeah, yeah. So okay, so I don't have this in my notes, but I do remember this note. He was supposed to be paroled in November, the year prior. However, the community got was the community was worried that he would be paroled and sent back to his parents house to live with his mother. So his parole got delayed by a couple of months until they found the appropriate place for him to go because they didn't want him to go to the same community.
00:32:26:27 - 00:32:27:16
Kevin
Got it.
00:32:27:18 - 00:32:34:18
Brandon
So he is now currently living just 300 miles away from Savannah in the borough of Queens in New York City.
00:32:34:18 - 00:32:39:14
Kevin
So we've got to be careful next time we go home Aaron.
00:32:39:17 - 00:32:59:19
Brandon
Yeah, so he's 43 now, going to be 44. And so interesting facts I have in here. And because of what Eric did to Derek, it was often asked if Eric was sexually abused to do something like that, the sodomy piece. So it was always denied. However, Eric's older sister came out to say that she was sexually abused by her stepfather.
00:32:59:19 - 00:33:04:13
Brandon
I mean, so people do think that there was something, but it's not it's not credible.
00:33:04:13 - 00:33:11:07
Kevin
But I sometimes I'm also like, I'm right when people are like, well, they were sexually abused, so they're going to sexually abuse of the people, too, which is actually not true.
00:33:11:07 - 00:33:28:06
Brandon
Yeah. Yeah. Another interesting facts that since the killing he has come out to say that and this is quoted my anger wasn't directed at Derrick at all. It was directed at all the other guys that used to pick on me. And then when I was torturing and killing Derek, that was what I saw in my head.
00:33:28:08 - 00:33:33:09
Kevin
Which is shitty. Yeah, Which. Yeah. So it could.
00:33:33:11 - 00:33:37:18
Kevin
I mean, who knows what his truth is. But hearing that, I'm like, yeah.
00:33:37:18 - 00:34:01:23
Brandon
And then Doreen and Derek Robbie say that they are relieved that they no longer have to be traumatized, retraumatized every two years for parole hearings. Yeah, because now that's over. They don't have to worry about that anymore. And then Doreen is also quoted saying, I don't let him take space in my head. I do not focus on where he is, what he's doing, because I don't care as long as he's not near friends and family.
00:34:01:25 - 00:34:03:15
Kevin
Yeah. Which I feel like is understandable.
00:34:03:17 - 00:34:13:13
Brandon
Yeah, I feel like this one's like a one that city didn't have to happen, but like, he was so young, he couldn't understand any of it.
00:34:13:16 - 00:34:16:04
Kevin
But he could, and it's just.
00:34:16:07 - 00:34:30:04
Kevin
It's difficult. It's. It's difficult because, you know, it's difficult. I don't know what motivates people to kill in general, but to take the time like he did to pose, to further.
00:34:30:07 - 00:34:30:29
Kevin
Like, mutilate.
00:34:30:29 - 00:34:34:15
Brandon
Yeah. And investigators said it sounded like he enjoyed it, like when they were.
00:34:34:15 - 00:34:35:18
Kevin
Speaking, they really enjoyed.
00:34:35:18 - 00:34:39:28
Brandon
It. And he obviously stayed there for a bit and like did stuff and whatever.
00:34:40:01 - 00:34:40:12
Kevin
Yeah.
00:34:40:20 - 00:34:44:04
Brandon
And so it's like you understand that you're doing it.
00:34:44:07 - 00:34:45:27
Kevin
You know. Oh.
00:34:46:00 - 00:34:47:12
Brandon
And now he lives in Queens.
00:34:47:15 - 00:34:58:16
Kevin
Oh, Eric, how do the people of New York are reformed? Yeah, Live life, love. Oh, my Lord. As a well, so not.
00:34:58:18 - 00:34:59:15
Brandon
Too crazy one, but a good.
00:34:59:15 - 00:35:01:25
Kevin
One. The last one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right.
00:35:01:25 - 00:35:03:06
Brandon
Well, you'll be ready for yours.
00:35:03:06 - 00:35:04:02
Kevin
Yeah.
00:35:04:04 - 00:35:05:10
Kevin
Yeah. Shall we?
00:35:05:17 - 00:35:06:05
Brandon
Let's do it.
00:35:06:07 - 00:35:11:14
Kevin
All right. Episode ten for me. I have named my episode again.
00:35:11:16 - 00:35:12:23
Kevin
You always have the best scenes.
00:35:13:01 - 00:35:21:26
Kevin
And my episode is titled Fuck this Milky marble eyeball Shitbag child.
00:35:21:29 - 00:35:24:10
Brandon
Milky marble eyeball.
00:35:24:10 - 00:35:28:25
Kevin
Yep. Okay. Fuck this milky marble eyeball shitbag child. Oh, okay. Okay.
00:35:29:02 - 00:35:33:19
Brandon
It's like every week they get longer and longer.
00:35:33:21 - 00:35:34:24
Kevin
Oh, they do. All right.
00:35:34:24 - 00:35:58:03
Kevin
So it was the chilly morning of April 23rd, 1874, when two boys, Jesse 18. So it isn't one when two boys, Jesse, who was 14 and Horace who was four, were seen walking toward the nearby bay after just visiting a local bakery. Horace Horace Which, by the way, it isn't, but it's the name of a character in Hello, Dolly.
00:35:58:06 - 00:35:59:12
Kevin
Yeah, which is also old.
00:35:59:12 - 00:36:00:22
Kevin
But understand.
00:36:00:25 - 00:36:02:02
Kevin
That anyway.
00:36:02:05 - 00:36:03:25
Kevin
I was in Philadelphia when I was in high school.
00:36:03:25 - 00:36:06:00
Brandon
So these are similar ages to 14 them.
00:36:06:02 - 00:36:08:24
Kevin
Yeah. Yeah. Uh, okay.
00:36:08:25 - 00:36:16:04
Kevin
So Horace, whose family had just moved to Dorchester Street, had dark brown eyes, bow shaped.
00:36:16:04 - 00:36:16:29
Kevin
Lips.
00:36:17:01 - 00:36:38:16
Kevin
And shiny blond hair, and was described as almost angelic in appearance. His mother loves dressing him up in fine clothes, so he wore a black velvet hat with a golden tassel, a black and white jacket, and a red and white checkered shirt. So Horace absolutely loved a sweet who doesn't as a child and with a couple of pennies from his mother, ventured out into the street to visit the local bakery.
00:36:38:16 - 00:36:40:15
Kevin
And this all takes place in Boston. But I was.
00:36:40:15 - 00:36:41:17
Brandon
Going to say, where is.
00:36:41:21 - 00:36:43:18
Kevin
Yeah, I address that a little bit, but might as well.
00:36:43:19 - 00:36:46:27
Kevin
On his way to the bakery. The bakery On his way.
00:36:46:27 - 00:36:57:06
Kevin
To the bakery, he met Jessie, the 14 year old who joined him on this trip to the bakery. So Horace at the bakery bought a small cake and shared it with Jessie. What a nice child.
00:36:57:09 - 00:36:59:27
Brandon
So, Horace, that's for is at the bakery buying stuff.
00:37:00:02 - 00:37:00:21
Kevin
Hmm. I mean, it's.
00:37:00:22 - 00:37:02:20
Brandon
I mean, it's 18, whatever, but I just.
00:37:02:22 - 00:37:08:07
Kevin
There's, like, a video, like, of early, early, I think 1900s where, like.
00:37:08:09 - 00:37:09:03
Kevin
It was just.
00:37:09:08 - 00:37:10:12
Kevin
Smaller, like on the street.
00:37:10:14 - 00:37:12:21
Brandon
There, like adults there, like the Benjamin Button with their.
00:37:12:28 - 00:37:14:19
Kevin
Top hat.
00:37:14:21 - 00:37:35:11
Kevin
They indulged in their, um, in the treats. So basically, Horace shares this, uh, this cake with, with Jessie. And afterwards, Jessie, the 14 year old suggests, Hey, let's take a trip down to the nearby harbor. And Horace was like, Absolutely. So they stood up, held hands, and started toward the bay.
00:37:35:13 - 00:37:36:25
Kevin
Um, a number of.
00:37:36:25 - 00:37:55:21
Kevin
People saw the boys as they headed to the bay. So one woman near the bakery recalled that the older boy seemed a little bit too excited and had a little bit of an odd expression on his face. Another witness who was near the marshy area south of the city. So basically they're walking to the bay, there's marsh and all that kind of stuff, and they are walking through there.
00:37:55:24 - 00:38:18:05
Kevin
That witness recalled seeing the two boys walking, um, by the felt or by and felt that the older boy seemed responsible, but it was weird that there were kids in that area because they typically weren't kids that were in the marshy area, especially with unknown adults. But he said that the kid looked kind of responsible, so he's like, I don't really see any issue there.
00:38:18:05 - 00:38:39:08
Kevin
So he didn't think anything about it. So as walked through the area of the marsh land that's known as the cow pasture, Jessie and Horace passed a boy that was a little older than Jessie, who had been digging for clams. The boy remembered thinking Horace was far too overdressed to be wandering around in the mud because it's a super muddy, yeah, wet area.
00:38:39:10 - 00:38:48:21
Kevin
So as they disappeared into the marsh, another man recalled seeing the boys walking and noticed the older boy kept looking over his shoulder. But he didn't really think much about it because nobody was following him.
00:38:48:22 - 00:38:51:09
Kevin
Oh yeah, but he's looking to see if anybody. The older boy was.
00:38:51:09 - 00:38:53:21
Kevin
Looking over his shoulder a lot.
00:38:53:23 - 00:38:55:01
Brandon
The older boys. Jessie.
00:38:55:04 - 00:38:56:05
Kevin
Yeah, Yeah.
00:38:56:07 - 00:39:07:02
Kevin
So the boys reads a swirl of swallows. Well, I don't know what that is, but I think it's like a dip in the marshy area. And Jessie told Horace that this would be a good time for them to rest, so they sat down.
00:39:07:04 - 00:39:08:26
Brandon
Rest. Where are you? Resting. Immerses.
00:39:08:29 - 00:39:09:18
Kevin
I don't know.
00:39:09:20 - 00:39:11:17
Brandon
Like, where are they supposed to be going?
00:39:11:19 - 00:39:14:13
Kevin
Don't know. So at that.
00:39:14:13 - 00:39:17:05
Kevin
Moment, it's a pause.
00:39:17:07 - 00:39:20:19
Brandon
Sorry I made fun of your name. I think something that's happening worries you.
00:39:20:25 - 00:39:39:21
Kevin
Jessie immediately pulls out a pocket knife, grabbed Horace and slashes his throat when Jessie realizes that his initial attack did not kill Horace, he became so angry that he went absolutely crazy, repeatedly stabbing the little boy over and over again. Horace, who must have been absolutely terrified.
00:39:39:24 - 00:39:41:17
Kevin
Actually fought back this little forward.
00:39:41:17 - 00:39:42:27
Brandon
Oh, my God, Horace.
00:39:43:00 - 00:39:44:07
Kevin
The reason they know this is that.
00:39:44:07 - 00:39:44:28
Kevin
There were.
00:39:45:01 - 00:40:04:07
Kevin
Really clear defensive wounds on his hands. Oh, arms as well as a deep gouges that he made in the sand with his flailing legs like this. And he also had clenched fists so hard that his fingernails were in better than this. Oh, my God. Yeah. Horace eventually died from his wounds to.
00:40:04:07 - 00:40:06:24
Brandon
Him for a four year to four year old to protect himself. That much?
00:40:06:24 - 00:40:07:03
Kevin
Yeah.
00:40:07:06 - 00:40:07:21
Brandon
Yeah, for him.
00:40:07:21 - 00:40:40:09
Kevin
Horace So, Horace, uh, eventually died from his wounds, but just continued on hacking at his body, puncturing Horace his right eye while attempting to also castrate the boy. So it wasn't until 4 p.m. that day that two brothers, George and James Power, stumbled upon Horace's mutilated body. So this is the story of Jessie Pomeroy, a 14 year old who in 1874 became the youngest person ever convicted of first degree murder in Massachusetts.
00:40:40:11 - 00:40:52:03
Kevin
So James, who's also known as the Boston boy fiend, killed two children and spent years prior to the killings, brutally beating and disfiguring others.
00:40:52:06 - 00:40:54:17
Kevin
That's awful. I feel like you just said, James.
00:40:54:19 - 00:40:57:24
Kevin
Jessie, Jessie. I made up the maps of James.
00:40:57:27 - 00:41:01:06
Kevin
Just you, Jessie. Jessie Pomeroy. A couple have.
00:41:01:08 - 00:41:11:00
Kevin
Some history on James. So James was born in Charlestown, Massachusetts, on November 20, 1959. It's actually said that he did not fit in, like at all.
00:41:11:02 - 00:41:12:06
Kevin
Anywhere where he was.
00:41:12:06 - 00:41:15:05
Kevin
Just not somebody who fit in in general.
00:41:15:07 - 00:41:16:23
Kevin
Because he certainly had it.
00:41:16:25 - 00:41:20:17
Kevin
But it's actually because he had a pretty bad birth defect in his right eye.
00:41:20:20 - 00:41:23:02
Kevin
Which actually has I.
00:41:23:05 - 00:41:28:09
Kevin
Was kind of white is it was like a marble colored eye. He had it makes sense.
00:41:28:09 - 00:41:29:20
Kevin
It's a title, you know.
00:41:29:22 - 00:41:32:22
Kevin
A thick white film that covered his pupil and everything. Well.
00:41:32:22 - 00:41:35:24
Brandon
And back then, any kind of deformity was frowned upon.
00:41:35:28 - 00:41:44:27
Kevin
Yeah. So people were revolted by him. And the number one person who was really revolted by him was his fucking done so.
00:41:44:27 - 00:41:46:01
Kevin
Well, that's great. Yeah.
00:41:46:01 - 00:41:46:19
Brandon
Thanks, Pops.
00:41:46:19 - 00:41:57:28
Kevin
Jessie, um, like your Eric was viciously bullied by kids that were bigger, taller and stronger than him. And so, in turn, he, too, would bully those that were smaller, shorter and weaker. That we.
00:41:57:29 - 00:41:58:29
Kevin
Just say bullying.
00:41:58:29 - 00:42:00:08
Brandon
Is like a really awful.
00:42:00:08 - 00:42:02:02
Kevin
Fucking bully people.
00:42:02:09 - 00:42:04:22
Brandon
So much trauma comes from bullying.
00:42:04:22 - 00:42:09:17
Kevin
Yeah, I was called a fag a lot in high school, but a lot of it was like, So you get.
00:42:09:21 - 00:42:10:02
Kevin
You get, you.
00:42:10:02 - 00:42:26:14
Kevin
Know, whatever. And I only had one like pretty severe incident. And there was this kid called his name was Toby and it was in the locker room. I ran cross-country and we always ended up in the locker room with the football players and everyone showered typically. I didn't always, which.
00:42:26:14 - 00:42:28:14
Brandon
Is weird because we never nobody showered. Really?
00:42:28:17 - 00:42:29:00
Kevin
Yeah, we.
00:42:29:01 - 00:42:34:26
Kevin
I mean, it was kind of a thing in gym class too. Like it. And I didn't I wasn't really bothered by having a shower with everybody. I wasn't like.
00:42:34:26 - 00:42:37:29
Kevin
A I think I think people help people.
00:42:37:29 - 00:42:38:09
Kevin
Perception.
00:42:38:12 - 00:42:39:29
Brandon
People have an idea that a gay person is just.
00:42:39:29 - 00:42:41:05
Kevin
Going to be like.
00:42:41:08 - 00:42:43:22
Brandon
No, I want to get in. I want to get the fuck out. I don't want to be around those.
00:42:43:22 - 00:42:44:10
Kevin
I would like to get out.
00:42:44:10 - 00:43:01:24
Kevin
Yeah, I was sitting up taking my shoes or untying something was I was doing something and this group of football players came over to me and they started to call me a fagot. And once Toby saw this dick in my face and told me that, you know, suck is cock or whatever, and it was very it was horrible, it's fucked.
00:43:01:24 - 00:43:03:14
Kevin
And fortunately the you should just.
00:43:03:14 - 00:43:04:15
Brandon
Punch him right in the dick.
00:43:04:15 - 00:43:05:20
Kevin
I should. Right.
00:43:05:22 - 00:43:07:12
Kevin
And some of the.
00:43:07:12 - 00:43:12:24
Kevin
Cross-country guys though, that kind of got him off me and I kind of ran out and it was a horrible thing.
00:43:12:24 - 00:43:14:03
Brandon
Well, yeah, that's so traumatizing.
00:43:14:03 - 00:43:20:19
Kevin
Yeah, but that was kind of the only thing that that happened to me too much because I started to become pretty busy and direct. And by my senior year I was.
00:43:20:19 - 00:43:23:22
Kevin
Like, Yeah, I'm fucking gay. And people were like, Okay, yeah.
00:43:23:24 - 00:43:25:06
Kevin
So it was a little bit different, but.
00:43:25:08 - 00:43:28:18
Kevin
But bully, like, stop bullying people. Yeah, it's like the worst.
00:43:28:20 - 00:43:32:20
Brandon
In, like online bullying just makes it even worse because then it's just a bunch of random.
00:43:32:20 - 00:43:34:16
Kevin
Fucking people on their computer, right?
00:43:34:18 - 00:43:37:25
Kevin
Yeah. I mean, we've gotten some weird ass comments, too, and I'm like.
00:43:37:28 - 00:43:40:26
Kevin
Okay, whatever. So yeah.
00:43:40:26 - 00:44:03:08
Kevin
Severe bullying in general that caused him to also be a pretty vicious bully to some people as well, especially those that were shorter, weaker and smaller than he was. So Jesse was a loner and he preferred to read something that were called dime novels. They were like cheap dime novels, which were stories that were full of blood, gory sex wars, battles and mayhem, basically.
00:44:03:11 - 00:44:05:20
Kevin
Like gaming.
00:44:05:22 - 00:44:07:09
Kevin
At this point. But it was all story.
00:44:07:12 - 00:44:08:00
Brandon
Yeah.
00:44:08:02 - 00:44:10:23
Kevin
Then Jesse was, uh.
00:44:10:25 - 00:44:27:15
Kevin
A loner in his family, too. He was ignored by his older brother. And his dad, whose name was Thomas. Um, actually would frequently beat him with a horsewhip and leather belt and would actually demand that Jesse stripped naked so that his dad could inflict more pain direct on.
00:44:27:15 - 00:44:30:20
Brandon
Oh, yeah. No wonder why he's. He would like, torture people like that.
00:44:30:21 - 00:44:32:10
Kevin
So fucked up. Don't abuse your.
00:44:32:10 - 00:44:33:14
Brandon
Children that bad in them.
00:44:33:14 - 00:44:35:13
Kevin
And I think okay so here's a common.
00:44:35:16 - 00:44:36:13
Kevin
I think thread.
00:44:36:13 - 00:44:44:28
Kevin
With serial killers and that's that at a young age Jesse would start to torture and kill small animals, which his mother, by the way, her name was Ruthann.
00:44:45:01 - 00:44:47:26
Kevin
Was aware of. And both of these parents.
00:44:47:26 - 00:44:55:27
Kevin
I know and Ruth in sticks out in my mind because I've talked about my adopted family before it, the Mormon family down the street. The mom's name was with him.
00:44:55:29 - 00:44:57:14
Kevin
And so I was like.
00:44:57:17 - 00:45:15:08
Kevin
Apparently the only person that was actually good to to Jesse was his mom, Ruthanne Pomeroy. So she thought that his issues were due to his bullying and that if people would just stop bullying him, that he would actually stop bullying others, which I don't know that that's not wrong. But he was also killing.
00:45:15:08 - 00:45:19:00
Brandon
Well, he was also doing smart at that point. This doesn't matter. Yeah.
00:45:19:02 - 00:45:28:11
Kevin
So so even with that, though, his mom, even though he started torturing and killing small animals, his mom would still dismiss that, saying that it was a sign of sadness.
00:45:28:14 - 00:45:31:03
Brandon
This was also the 1800s. They didn't know shit about.
00:45:31:03 - 00:45:31:19
Kevin
Shit, but.
00:45:31:22 - 00:45:37:03
Kevin
You're a parent these days and your child is torturing and murdering animals. Figure out the fuck.
00:45:37:03 - 00:45:45:06
Brandon
Out, right. Like there's something wrong. We're looking directly at the camera. If your child is killing animals, there's a problem.
00:45:45:13 - 00:45:46:08
Kevin
There's an issue.
00:45:46:10 - 00:45:49:04
Brandon
And it might be you.
00:45:49:07 - 00:46:10:11
Kevin
Stop whipping your children with dogs. Okay, So in 1871, in the city of Chelsea, which was just across the river from Charles Town, children began to suffer a vicious beatings at the hands of a boy that some described as bigger, taller and stronger than they were. And then some were also sexually assaulted. So this kind of a force.
00:46:10:11 - 00:46:12:29
Brandon
This is like the preemptive was he started by just beating.
00:46:12:29 - 00:46:13:23
Kevin
And sexually was.
00:46:13:23 - 00:46:18:26
Kevin
When Jesse, I think was 11 or 12. So not too long before because he was 14 when he Yeah. Yeah.
00:46:18:29 - 00:46:20:02
Kevin
They said that the boy would.
00:46:20:02 - 00:46:26:29
Kevin
Basically befriend them, offer them money and treats and they would take and then he would take them to a remote location where he'd have his way with them.
00:46:27:01 - 00:46:28:02
Kevin
So the boy.
00:46:28:02 - 00:46:34:16
Kevin
Actually became known because I couldn't figure who out who it was. And it was several kids. Yeah, all boys.
00:46:34:18 - 00:46:35:03
Kevin
But the.
00:46:35:03 - 00:46:38:17
Kevin
Boy became known as the Boy Torturer and the Red.
00:46:38:17 - 00:46:40:23
Kevin
Devil. Oh, which is creepy.
00:46:40:23 - 00:46:41:22
Brandon
The red devil.
00:46:41:22 - 00:46:42:09
Kevin
Red devil.
00:46:42:12 - 00:46:47:10
Brandon
So was there a specific type of child? Like, what did he go after? Boys? Girls were.
00:46:47:12 - 00:46:48:05
Kevin
Just boys.
00:46:48:05 - 00:47:02:29
Kevin
Just boys that were smaller than him. Smaller, shorter, you know, that kind of thing. So anyway, a description of this boy of Jesse was published in the Boston Globe, which Ruth and his mom read and recognized. So then she.
00:47:02:29 - 00:47:03:23
Kevin
Immediately.
00:47:03:24 - 00:47:08:02
Kevin
Moved the family to South Boston because of that.
00:47:08:04 - 00:47:13:15
Brandon
So instead of like doing anything like, significant about it, she's like, Oh, we'll just move.
00:47:13:16 - 00:47:16:12
Kevin
It'll be fucking Ruth-Anne doesn't mean that he's he's.
00:47:16:17 - 00:47:19:22
Brandon
He's already killing animals. He's abusing people. Like he's there's something.
00:47:19:22 - 00:47:20:23
Kevin
Runs out initial.
00:47:20:25 - 00:47:21:04
Brandon
There.
00:47:21:04 - 00:47:34:05
Kevin
So in August of 1872, a young boy was found a tortured on the sands of South Boston. And that following September another child was found beaten, assaulted and tied up to a telephone post.
00:47:34:07 - 00:47:36:11
Kevin
So the city that's like out in public, I.
00:47:36:11 - 00:47:50:02
Kevin
Know the shitty thing is, is that he would and I didn't put any of this in here because there's a lot of victims. But he would basically take like a board and it's like fucking beat the shit out of their face. So he'd knock teeth out. I mean, it was just it was fucking he had.
00:47:50:02 - 00:47:50:15
Brandon
Some anger.
00:47:50:15 - 00:47:56:02
Kevin
Issues. So anyway, uh, that victim that was tied up to the telephone post gave us.
00:47:56:02 - 00:47:57:03
Kevin
Such a good.
00:47:57:03 - 00:47:58:27
Kevin
Description of his assailant.
00:47:58:29 - 00:48:00:15
Kevin
That, Oh, he didn't die.
00:48:00:17 - 00:48:02:08
Kevin
No, none of those kids died.
00:48:02:08 - 00:48:05:11
Kevin
Oh. Oh, I thought we were getting to hell. Now. These.
00:48:05:12 - 00:48:10:12
Kevin
We jumped back. These are all the kids that were being, like, tortured and, like. And you know.
00:48:10:14 - 00:48:12:15
Kevin
All that before.
00:48:12:17 - 00:48:21:23
Kevin
Course that the telephone posts that that could give such a good description of the assailant that he was able to identify.
00:48:21:26 - 00:48:23:13
Kevin
The very peculiar.
00:48:23:13 - 00:48:26:21
Kevin
Right eye, a white eye that resembled marble.
00:48:26:21 - 00:48:30:06
Kevin
Well there you go, Jesse.
00:48:30:08 - 00:48:42:07
Kevin
So Jesse Pomeroy was in arrested and sentenced to the state reform school at Westboro. So Ruthanne, however, was able to get him out only a few months later.
00:48:42:13 - 00:48:44:20
Brandon
Yeah. So when they talked about those parents that just.
00:48:44:20 - 00:48:45:20
Kevin
Like jail.
00:48:45:22 - 00:48:47:08
Brandon
Can bring their kids to.
00:48:47:08 - 00:48:49:26
Kevin
The police, you're an asshole. Yeah, you should.
00:48:49:26 - 00:48:52:05
Brandon
Be. You should be put in jail the same amount.
00:48:52:05 - 00:49:01:23
Kevin
Say no. Here's what city and where they were now in Charlestown. She kept the fact that he got out of this reform school very quiet.
00:49:02:00 - 00:49:03:02
Kevin
The locals actually.
00:49:03:02 - 00:49:08:24
Kevin
Didn't even think he was out and thought he was locked away. He was it was in the paper. Everybody knew who this fucker was.
00:49:08:27 - 00:49:13:14
Kevin
But my God. So he was out and people in nobody know. So that's.
00:49:13:14 - 00:49:13:26
Brandon
Even more.
00:49:13:28 - 00:49:17:09
Kevin
Exciting. Remember, this is prior to Horace March 18th, 1870.
00:49:17:09 - 00:49:18:24
Kevin
Four, a girl.
00:49:18:26 - 00:49:34:21
Kevin
Named Katie Curran disappeared from her home in South Boston. She had left She had left to buy a notebook but was never seen again. So after some investigation. It was discovered that the last place she had been was at the Pomeroy's shop because they owned a shop in South Boston.
00:49:34:23 - 00:49:35:24
Kevin
Basically, the.
00:49:35:24 - 00:49:53:16
Kevin
Investigation led them to the Pomeroy shop where Jessie actually worked. But they did an investigation search the store and they didn't find anything. So there was some other shit about people who said that it was somebody else and whatever. So it kind of fell off the radar. But she was missing. Now let's jump back up to April 23rd, 1874.
00:49:53:18 - 00:49:56:17
Kevin
So Horace was discovered on the beach and it.
00:49:56:17 - 00:49:57:19
Brandon
Was Horace, the first.
00:49:57:19 - 00:50:04:23
Kevin
Horace Malone killed. Yeah. So he was the for after all those tortures and all that shit he went to for reform school, came back, Horace was killed.
00:50:04:24 - 00:50:08:06
Brandon
I wonder what, like, made him switch to be like, I'm going to do it now. I'm going to kill someone now.
00:50:08:11 - 00:50:28:22
Kevin
I don't know. Um, so anyway, Horace Millan was. His name was discovered on the beach after the coroner cleaned the body. He found dozens of defense wounds. As I said earlier, he found 18 stab wounds to the torso, a punctured eyeball and mutilated genitals. So the examiner noted that it was the work of a mad man.
00:50:28:27 - 00:50:29:26
Kevin
Yes.
00:50:29:29 - 00:50:46:14
Kevin
So police issued a report to several journalists who were waiting at the mortuary. They also issued a bulletin to all stations to get help identifying the victim. So even though Horace had gone out and all this kind of stuff, there was 1874. I mean, there was no. Yeah, right. 1874. Yeah, it just isn't what today is.
00:50:46:15 - 00:50:46:25
Brandon
Yeah.
00:50:46:25 - 00:50:51:09
Kevin
So his mom actually had reported him missing and they were like looking and whatever throughout the day.
00:50:51:09 - 00:50:54:21
Kevin
But yeah.
00:50:54:23 - 00:51:11:03
Kevin
Anyway, so because of that it wasn't that long before the South Boston precincts wired back for more details. Course, his mother had already reported him missing and by 9 p.m. of that same day in 1874, police, a police officer was sent to the Milan home to deliver the news of her dad's son.
00:51:11:05 - 00:51:12:08
Kevin
That's very quick.
00:51:12:10 - 00:51:16:20
Brandon
Like especially in like a marsh, like I couldn't imagine it's a popular place that people would walk around.
00:51:16:20 - 00:51:36:02
Kevin
The reason that he was found was because there were two boys that were looking for clams in the area. But when they were looking out there at the tide, they didn't they misjudged the timing of the tide. So they were just kind of looking around. So they actually happened upon his body like not that long after, like literally tomorrow, if I think.
00:51:36:07 - 00:51:42:07
Kevin
And they say he died between 11 and three G's. Yeah. So that these two boys actually found him pretty quick.
00:51:42:08 - 00:51:42:28
Kevin
And I put.
00:51:42:28 - 00:51:44:06
Kevin
Their names and stumbling.
00:51:44:06 - 00:51:44:14
Brandon
Upon.
00:51:44:14 - 00:51:45:23
Kevin
A dead body. Yeah.
00:51:45:25 - 00:51:46:29
Brandon
I don't really ever want to have.
00:51:46:29 - 00:51:48:24
Kevin
That happen now.
00:51:48:27 - 00:52:13:28
Kevin
So anyway, there was only one logical suspect, but Jessie was supposed to be locked away at Westborough Reformatory, so the police didn't initially. They were like, He's he's not here Anyway. It wasn't until the Boston chief of detectives reported that Jessie Pomeroy had actually been released on parole from there. And so immediately Jessie was picked up once they found their new house.
00:52:14:00 - 00:52:34:04
Kevin
So Jessie didn't immediately admit to any crimes. And in fact, when faced with six Amanda, the six police officers all firing questions at him. He denied involvement, spinning stories of where he had been during the day, of course, went missing. But he had a large gap of time where he could not offer an alibi from 11 to 3, literally when this little boy.
00:52:34:04 - 00:52:35:12
Brandon
Yeah, because he was murdered.
00:52:35:13 - 00:52:50:23
Kevin
Yeah. So when the officers inspected Jessie, they found a marsh grass and mud stuck to his shoes, scratches on his face, and a blood stain on his shirt. He also admitted to owning a knife, which was collected from his mother's house. And that knife had mud and what appeared to be dried blood on it.
00:52:50:24 - 00:52:56:07
Brandon
And this is all before they could do any testing of the soil to see if the same and in fact, blood in the blood.
00:52:56:09 - 00:53:09:25
Kevin
Yes. But they did ask him, like, how is there not more blood on the knife? And he was like, I stabbed it into the ground. Know. So they also got and I found this to be interesting. There were trails of shoe marks in the mud.
00:53:09:27 - 00:53:11:18
Kevin
So they took.
00:53:11:20 - 00:53:16:03
Kevin
A plaster of his shoe and a plaster cast of the shoe prints in.
00:53:16:03 - 00:53:17:07
Kevin
The mud then.
00:53:17:09 - 00:53:34:26
Kevin
And compared it and they matched it. So Jessie continued tonight to deny that even with presented with that until they were like, We're going to take you to his body. And so when they did that, he broke down and admitted to killing Horace then so he's quoted as saying, I'm sorry I did it. Please don't tell my mother.
00:53:34:29 - 00:53:37:10
Brandon
How would your mother not find out about that?
00:53:37:12 - 00:53:41:27
Kevin
So just such a weird fucking plea. Don't tell Mama. Don't tell my mommy.
00:53:41:29 - 00:53:46:27
Kevin
So then Jessie became the primary suspect in the disappearance of Katie Curran.
00:53:47:04 - 00:53:49:20
Kevin
Obviously. So a little then.
00:53:49:27 - 00:53:58:07
Kevin
A little more than a month after Jessie's arrest, when the Pomeroy's store had to be shut down because obviously people were not shopping at their store anymore.
00:53:58:12 - 00:53:58:19
Kevin
Yeah.
00:53:58:20 - 00:54:18:10
Kevin
Knowing what he did, their former co tenant decided to expand their business, which meant that they had to take over the basement of the former shop that had to be refurbished. So it wasn't too long before a group of workers discovered a body, which was the decaying remains of Kate Curran.
00:54:18:12 - 00:54:23:01
Kevin
So let's jump back to March 18. What about her, 1874?
00:54:23:04 - 00:54:23:19
Kevin
No.
00:54:23:22 - 00:54:25:14
Brandon
I totally forgot about her. I'm sorry, Katie.
00:54:25:18 - 00:54:27:23
Kevin
Who? The little girl. Katie. Yeah. Oh, gone.
00:54:27:26 - 00:54:48:29
Kevin
So jump back to March 18th, 1874, just six weeks after he was paroled from that Westborough school. Katie Curran, who was ten years old, was dressed in a black and green plaid dress and a wore an overcoat and scarf and ventured to the Pomeroy store in search of a notebook that she needed for school. So Jessie told Katie that there was.
00:54:49:01 - 00:54:49:19
Kevin
A notebook.
00:54:49:19 - 00:54:58:06
Kevin
But the one notebook that they had had like a stain on it, but that they had more because the store extended into their basement. And so.
00:54:58:06 - 00:54:59:18
Kevin
She was sucked.
00:54:59:18 - 00:55:27:09
Kevin
Into the basement. And as they began to go down the stairs, she noticed that there was actually not a store down there, but it was too late. Jessie immediately threw his arms around her neck and over her mouth and with his knife, slit her throat right then, which that one that killed her. So he then dragged her behind a water closet where they concluded he completely severed or head cut her clothes open, and then attacked her torso and genitals.
00:55:27:09 - 00:55:36:22
Kevin
And I read a quote that said, In what? And he attacked her torso and genitals. And it was so bad that that was actually when her body was decomposing.
00:55:36:24 - 00:55:37:24
Kevin
They couldn't.
00:55:37:27 - 00:55:44:04
Kevin
See decomposed so much from the torso first that they couldn't really identify how many.
00:55:44:07 - 00:55:44:16
Kevin
She had.
00:55:44:16 - 00:55:45:29
Kevin
But it was such a messy, you know.
00:55:46:01 - 00:55:51:17
Kevin
How did nobody finds that? I don't know. How did nobody smells, though? How did nobody unless.
00:55:51:17 - 00:55:52:11
Brandon
They did And they were like it.
00:55:52:11 - 00:55:53:25
Kevin
Was only it was it was a month.
00:55:53:25 - 00:55:54:09
Kevin
Later.
00:55:54:10 - 00:55:56:17
Kevin
I mean, but the body would have had to stop smelling.
00:55:56:21 - 00:55:58:18
Brandon
There would have been blood everywhere. Like, well.
00:55:58:21 - 00:56:10:19
Kevin
Once he did all that, he covered her body with ashes and stones, washed his hands and went back to the store. There is something that said that when they found her body that they're not that he totally cut off her head or if when they were digging.
00:56:10:21 - 00:56:11:04
Kevin
Around.
00:56:11:07 - 00:56:11:28
Kevin
The shovel, maybe.
00:56:11:28 - 00:56:13:05
Kevin
Cut off their hands.
00:56:13:08 - 00:56:14:02
Kevin
But they weren't even.
00:56:14:02 - 00:56:14:14
Brandon
Her is.
00:56:14:14 - 00:56:16:04
Kevin
Awful. I don't want my head, head.
00:56:16:05 - 00:56:33:29
Kevin
So ultimately he did all of this torturing of all these kids, and then he killed both Horace and Katie during that time. So anyway, Jessie was in custody when Katie's body was found. And because of that, both his mom, Ruth and Charles, his brother, were both taken into custody and charged with accessory to murder.
00:56:33:29 - 00:56:35:26
Kevin
Good. At first, he.
00:56:35:26 - 00:56:50:17
Kevin
Kept denying Katie. He's like, No, no, no, I didn't. You know, I don't know anything about that, whatever. But once he was presented with the fact that his mother and brother were arrested, he confessed. And when asked why he said it, he said, I don't know. I wanted to see how she would act.
00:56:50:19 - 00:56:52:05
Brandon
So he killed her before.
00:56:52:05 - 00:57:02:03
Kevin
HARRIS Yeah, he did. So Jessie was eventually found guilty of the murder of both Horace Mellon and Katie Curran and was sentenced to death.
00:57:02:05 - 00:57:04:01
Kevin
Good words. There was a.
00:57:04:01 - 00:57:05:21
Brandon
14 year old going to death.
00:57:05:23 - 00:57:22:06
Kevin
I know there was a whole thing about, like him being a minor in the death penalty, because that was when they did that. They hung. Ooh, yeah. He was hanging death by hanging. There was a lot of, like, shit about like, well, maybe he's insane, maybe or whatever to try to not get him to be convicted and sentenced to death.
00:57:22:08 - 00:57:42:09
Kevin
But anyway, he was he was sentenced to death. He was found guilty of the murder of both horse Nolan and Katie Curran and was sentenced to death. So his sentence was actually commuted, though, to life in prison to be spent in solitary confinement. So September 7th, 1876. This is a quick that one. He was not up.
00:57:42:11 - 00:57:43:20
Kevin
Huh?
00:57:43:22 - 00:57:46:08
Brandon
That's like unheard of. Quick, at least for.
00:57:46:08 - 00:57:47:13
Kevin
Well, these days.
00:57:47:13 - 00:57:53:17
Kevin
He killed them in 1874. And he was I mean, he was found pretty quickly. So actually it was a few years.
00:57:53:20 - 00:57:58:09
Brandon
Yeah. But now it's like people are on arm.
00:57:58:11 - 00:57:59:21
Kevin
I mean, what else can take forever?
00:57:59:21 - 00:58:00:06
Kevin
Yeah, no, I.
00:58:00:06 - 00:58:02:20
Brandon
Know, but they're on, but they, they don't get.
00:58:02:25 - 00:58:03:26
Kevin
I can't even think about.
00:58:03:27 - 00:58:04:22
Kevin
I don't know what you're saying.
00:58:04:26 - 00:58:07:21
Kevin
Yeah. Just keep going. Anyway. So December 7th.
00:58:07:21 - 00:58:32:13
Kevin
1876, he was locked up in the Massachusetts two state prison in Charlestown, and died in prison. So. But then spent most of his time in solitary confinement. There are a couple of documentaries about this, and I think that they have a version of this on a TV show that's actually out right now that Dakota Fanning's and I can't remember the name of it, Really?
00:58:32:15 - 00:58:40:24
Kevin
Uh huh, yeah. So there was like, there's some pictures that I found with this guy that had the milky eye, and I was like, Is that him? And I think it is. But anyway.
00:58:40:27 - 00:58:41:24
Brandon
Creepy.
00:58:41:26 - 00:58:42:28
Kevin
Yeah. And him children.
00:58:42:28 - 00:58:48:03
Kevin
And he was creepy. He looked creepiest, but, you know, he looked like Albert Fish in his older years.
00:58:48:04 - 00:58:55:24
Kevin
I mean, we're going to put him in the in the graphic. In the graphic, so you'll see it. But it was fucked up. So, yeah, that was. Oh, that was a fucked up one.
00:58:55:24 - 00:59:00:02
Kevin
I know the story of Jesse Pomeroy milk.
00:59:00:02 - 00:59:03:09
Kevin
I'd marvel them, but fuck this milky.
00:59:03:09 - 00:59:04:22
Kevin
Marble eyeball shitbag.
00:59:04:22 - 00:59:06:18
Kevin
Child. Yeah, fuck that child.
00:59:06:18 - 00:59:08:02
Brandon
Fuck both children.
00:59:08:04 - 00:59:08:27
Kevin
Killing children.
00:59:08:28 - 00:59:09:25
Kevin
Except.
00:59:09:27 - 00:59:10:20
Brandon
Eric. Don't kill.
00:59:10:20 - 00:59:13:23
Kevin
Us. I know. Also, there was a lot of killer children.
00:59:13:23 - 00:59:15:00
Brandon
So there were quite a bit.
00:59:15:00 - 00:59:15:10
Kevin
Yeah.
00:59:15:11 - 00:59:16:27
Kevin
We'll be recycling this topic.
00:59:16:29 - 00:59:25:14
Brandon
Well, eventually. Want to do one where it's children who've killed their parents? Because I think that's so fucking creepy. You bring this to your life. It's a life, and they just.
00:59:25:14 - 00:59:26:09
Kevin
Come and kill you.
00:59:26:09 - 00:59:27:23
Kevin
That's like they're Melinda's brothers.
00:59:27:24 - 00:59:28:05
Kevin
Yeah.
00:59:28:06 - 00:59:31:13
Kevin
Yeah. Like, you know who that is, right? Yes, but I think they're twins.
00:59:31:14 - 00:59:33:26
Brandon
I'm so bad at remembering things. I know what you're.
00:59:33:26 - 00:59:41:06
Kevin
Talking about, but way. All right, that's it. That was, uh. Yeah, was. Sorry, that was a few weeks late. Yeah, Sorry. You.
00:59:41:09 - 00:59:43:08
Kevin
That's enough that you're going to keep listening, and hopefully.
00:59:43:08 - 00:59:44:10
Brandon
You actually listen.
00:59:44:10 - 00:59:51:29
Kevin
You know? But remember, please subscribe, follow Ray and review. You can find us at Homicide podcast for Homicide. The podcast.
00:59:52:00 - 00:59:52:27
Brandon
Homicide Podcast.
00:59:52:29 - 00:59:55:10
Kevin
Yeah, Homicide. No, I mean, our social handles.
00:59:55:11 - 00:59:55:29
Brandon
Homicide, the.
00:59:56:02 - 00:59:58:17
Kevin
Podcast. So most almost.
00:59:58:20 - 01:00:17:02
Kevin
So my Homicide podcast dot com is our website. Definitely go there because we have some swag and all that much. But then also follow us on social at Homicide of their podcast, but definitely be sure to subscribe on YouTube if you like to watch it on video and then please follow us on wherever you listen to your your podcast.
01:00:17:02 - 01:00:19:05
Kevin
But please do go right and review those. Do and.
01:00:19:05 - 01:00:19:27
Brandon
Tell your friends.
01:00:19:27 - 01:00:21:05
Kevin
People grow. Yeah.
01:00:21:07 - 01:00:23:15
Brandon
Tell your friends how amazing. Almost.
01:00:23:17 - 01:00:28:18
Kevin
Yes, playing Vine. But anyway, also send in your hometown murders. Oh my God.
01:00:28:18 - 01:00:31:24
Kevin
The Murder at Homicide podcast. And remember.
01:00:31:24 - 01:00:32:25
Kevin
You will likely get.
01:00:32:25 - 01:00:37:13
Kevin
To join us if you want on the podcast to share your own hometown murder, which is really exciting.
01:00:37:13 - 01:00:40:17
Kevin
So anyway, that's that. Next.
01:00:40:20 - 01:00:47:12
Kevin
Hopefully our producer, Anna will be back on next week. She should be super fun to do it. Her and I will be in New York, so yeah.
01:00:47:14 - 01:00:53:02
Kevin
Thanks for going on this journey with. Yes, we appreciate. Bye.
and I'm Brandon.
Anna Howard (01:34.493)
and I'm Anna. Ah!
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:36.046)
Anna! I love this. For everyone listening, Homocide, the podcast is for the girls, gays, and theys who love true crime and hate the culture of sensationalizing murder.
Brandon (01:49.954)
Yes, and today's episode is on bizarre murder weapons. And my episode has the title of porcelain rage. What's yours, Kev?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (02:00.61)
goodness. Mine can be described in one word, Humpernickel.
Yeah, we'll get to see what that means. That juice is interesting. How are both of you guys?
Anna Howard (02:07.981)
Okay. I'm good, I'm freezing cold in my room right now because my radiator doesn't work. But other than that, I'm doing so well. It's very cold. It's just a little bit chilly. It was like, it was in the 20s this morning, so.
Brandon (02:08.47)
Just pumpernickel.
Brandon (02:20.153)
Oh no.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (02:22.978)
Fantastic.
Brandon (02:23.079)
And it's like fairly cold in New York today, isn't it?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (02:26.666)
Yeah, it's a little bit chilly. Yeah. I'm like, it's a little chilly. It's pretty fucking cold.
Brandon (02:30.006)
Oh yeah, it's 30. It's 71 here in Tampa, Florida. Ugh.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (02:35.114)
Yeah, I did see that and I was like, I'm not gonna do that. So I've been inside all day. Yeah, but that polar vortex that's happening right now across the United States is coming to New York. So it does snow this week, I think. Yeah, and it's like 16 degrees or something. I'm like, oh.
Anna Howard (02:38.324)
Yeah.
Brandon (02:38.445)
Enjoy it.
Anna Howard (02:47.046)
Oh, I didn't know that. Yay.
Brandon (02:48.95)
Yeah. And yeah, and by the time that you're listening to this, it will be, it had snowed a week ago.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (02:55.61)
Mm. True. We are recording before.
Anna Howard (02:57.833)
I just want the snow to actually stick on the ground because it keeps snowing and then it's like it just rained and the fun of snow is to have it stick on the ground.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (03:04.438)
I know.
I agree, because I kind of want to go play in the park with the snow, right? Like, who am I going to play with myself? But, and not in a weird way. But still, you know. Anyway, we're recording today and Anna and I are both in New York, not too far from each other. And Brandon is still in Tampa. So there's that.
Anna Howard (03:10.613)
Yeah, me too.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (03:29.898)
Um, it's weird to be a Brandon. I've been apart for a hot minute, which is, uh, you know, when you're married and have been together as long as we have it, it's a little bit weird, but.
Brandon (03:35.159)
Not usual.
Yeah, well, I mean, for the last, but we're almost hitting six years of owning our own business. And for those six years, we have been together almost that whole time. So anytime we have a part, it's always just a little bit bizarre. Not as bizarre as these murder weapons, but bizarre.
Anna Howard (03:49.833)
Wait, I feel like you guys, y'all should fill the audience in a little bit, like how did owning a business together come about, how did that happen?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (03:51.794)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (04:00.366)
Great question. God, well, it actually, no, it's actually kind of a funny story. It jumps back to when Brandon and I, the first night that we met, we met through a mutual friend and that mutual friend was like when I moved to New York. Our mutual friend named Michael I met at Disney because I did the Disney college program back in the day.
Anna Howard (04:03.025)
You're like, I don't know.
Brandon (04:04.011)
Right, that is.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (04:22.366)
and he grew up in Connecticut with Brandon. And so one day when we were in Disney, he was like, there's this guy that I have always had a crush on who's gonna come hang out with us. And I was like, okay, he's like, you should come. And I didn't, cause I was going on a date with a girl. That's a whole other thing. But so I went on a date instead and Brandon ended up hanging out with those guys. Anyway, so jump fast forward when I'm moving out to New York city.
Brandon (04:33.506)
Ooh.
Anna Howard (04:40.34)
Oh my god.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (04:48.578)
And I was already there. My friend Michael was back in Connecticut and he goes, remember that guy that I had a crush on, he just came out and I think that you should talk to him since you've been out since you were 17. And I was like, okay. Yeah, so I reached out to Brandon. I was like, hey, do you wanna meet up? But I remember looking at his Facebook profile and I was like, yo, not my type. But I wasn't even in a space to like date somebody because I was still with, not really with my ex, but I had, okay.
Anna Howard (05:05.709)
Oh my god. That's so rude.
Brandon (05:05.995)
So rude, right? Right? So rude.
Brandon (05:15.354)
Because he was just a bitch. I'm just kidding.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (05:18.638)
Maybe that too. But anyway, so we met and hung out and that night Brandon, I was like, what do you want to do with your future or whatever, which is such an intense question to ask on a not first date. So
Anna Howard (05:30.637)
What do you wanna do with your future?
Brandon (05:31.258)
Right? In little like 20, what, how old was I? 23. 23 year old me was like, oh, I don't know. I think I want to own my own agency.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (05:37.154)
I think so. They don't know. Yeah, so that's what he said. He's like, I think I want to own my own agency one day. And I was like, what? Yeah. So anyway, we kind of went on a path and I was at an agency because I'd switched my career and all this kind of shit. So anyway, I was kind of like, I don't want to work for anybody anymore. Brandon has this dream to own this thing and I think I can do it. So I left my job and I was like a creative director of-
Anna Howard (05:39.081)
I don't know.
Anna Howard (05:42.573)
Wow.
Wait, that's wild. You actually did, though. Ha ha.
Brandon (05:47.89)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (06:06.954)
a photo and started our agency in Tampa, not knowing one person. And I, yeah.
Brandon (06:13.514)
Yeah, we moved up here and started it right away.
Anna Howard (06:16.329)
Why did you move there if you don't know anybody?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (06:19.466)
Um, Brandon.
Brandon (06:21.462)
Oh, man, you're asking all these questions that are so layered, right? So for a quick synopsis, you're like, I have no idea. I'm sorry. So we were living in. Yeah. So we were we met in New York. We moved to Denver for a little bit. Kevin got recruited back to New York with the job he was working. So we moved back to New York within six months. We both ended up getting laid off from our jobs. And we had. Yeah, we had no money. Kevin's was coming. Yeah. So he.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (06:25.518)
They are very layered.
Anna Howard (06:29.309)
Oops.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (06:29.787)
Oh, no.
Anna Howard (06:46.061)
Classic.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (06:47.84)
Ish. My layoff was coming, but I walked out. But Brandon was definitely laid off.
Brandon (06:51.534)
He ended up walking out before it happened. But we, yeah, we had just moved. It was only six months. We didn't really have any money. So we decided reluctantly to move down to Florida to be closer to my family. Because at that time we kind of had a rocky relationship. And it was really Kevin who was like, yes, let's move down to Florida because we can fix this relationship and kind of figure it out from there. In our apartment at the time, we were able to move down to an apartment in.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (06:54.002)
No.
Anna Howard (06:54.765)
Slay.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (07:09.557)
Mm-hmm.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (07:21.239)
Near Miami or for Lauderdale.
Brandon (07:21.754)
in Florida for free, but they told us when we went to go tell our lease, our apartment at the time, that we wanted to move apartments because they owned properties. And they said, we're selling all of the Florida properties by the end of the year, so you have to do it by the end of the year. And it was like December 1st that we went and told them. So within a couple of weeks, we had to find an apartment and move. And
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (07:43.15)
Yeah.
Brandon (07:49.674)
we could only find an apartment in South Florida. But I went to college in Sarasota, which is on the other coast of Florida. And I just thought, I think if we're gonna go anywhere, I think Tampa just makes sense. It's a lot more urban. It's a little bit different of a city in Florida. So it doesn't have like that gross Florida feel. But the only properties they had were in South Florida. So we moved down to South Florida for two years and it was probably the most depressive time of our lives. We ended up going up to Tampa for my...
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (08:01.954)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (08:13.738)
horrible. It was horrible. It's where we got fat.
Anna Howard (08:15.792)
Oh no.
Brandon (08:18.274)
30th birthday, yeah, we got fat. We went up to Tampa for my 30th birthday and we were like, yep, we're moving here. So I moved maybe a month later, I moved up, we bought a house, I moved up first. And then for nine months, Kevin worked remotely so he would come home on the weekends and go down to South Florida during the week. And there was multiple times where he would come up during the week, come up on Tuesday night and go back.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (08:28.97)
You moved first.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (08:38.49)
But it worked remotely. Yeah.
Brandon (08:45.954)
Wednesday morning, the three, three and a half hour drive just because he wanted to be home. So it was a lot. So when we decided to start the business and for Kevin to quit his job and come up, we were like, fuck it, let's just start it. Kevin will dive right in. He has that kind of personality where he doesn't care if people don't like him or what they think about him, but he's gonna come be himself no matter what he wants to do and, and just be him and it proved to be very good for us because he was able to grow this whole
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (08:47.598)
It was horrible.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (09:03.154)
He's aggressive.
Brandon (09:14.466)
this whole shebang and now we have a staff of, there's seven of us, we're probably gonna be hiring two more people this year and we're a full creative and marketing agency and we do a lot of really fun work for some of our clients.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (09:20.791)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (09:26.006)
Yeah, it's pretty cool what we were able to kind of grow, but I was able to grow it enough to have Brian leave his job within a year, which is crazy. And so he left and then we've been growing since then. We'll be hitting six years in April, which is stupid crazy. But yeah.
Brandon (09:32.698)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Anna Howard (09:32.993)
Wow, that's amazing.
Brandon (09:39.286)
Yeah. And now, yeah, and part of our dream was to be able to get back to New York. And so this year we really, or last year, we really worked hard to figure it out. And so by May we got back up to New York with our apartment and now we've been doing this, this cross country. I almost, I want to say by coastal every time, but it's not.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (09:55.338)
by state, you know, whatever thing, which is interesting. I almost did too, but that's not right. It's like, it's actually technically called reverse snowbirds, reverse snowbirds, because snowbirds relocates. Like Brandon's parents are technically snowbirds because they moved from Connecticut to South Florida or to Lakeland, Florida to like get away from the cold. And then we are doing both, which is a reverse snowbird. So we like go down and then come back, go down, come back, whatever.
Anna Howard (10:11.197)
Okay, yeah. Oh, and you moved here. Yeah.
Mm.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (10:20.406)
which is interesting, but we never wanted to leave New York City, like at all. In fact, I went into like a pretty bad depressive state and I had this cool freelance job at this photo place working as like a digital tech for a company that did mostly e-com fashion, so they shot for like Macy's and all these things and I was running, basically running the set. And they kept me on, but I had a huge panic attack in the fucking airport in South Florida to come back here.
and couldn't get on the plane and was definitely fired. I mean, I wasn't fired because I was a contractor, but it was horrible. And so, yeah, that part of our life was rough. And we also worked for this company and this guy that he said to me once that somehow I got labeled as like the issue, which I think is because I was just so direct in general, but Brandon and I worked there together, but he actually pulled me in his office one day and he was like, I think that...
Brandon (10:59.331)
It was rough.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (11:14.686)
your rough childhood is coming out in your adulthood. And I was like, first off, thank you. I was like, you will never talk about that again, ever. I was such a cunt. But like he, oh, he was, it was not great. Yeah, so I ended up leaving before Brandon left. And then we left, or then he left, or whatever. And then I went to that other agency and then well, a little of Tampa, there we are. And now we're in New York and Tampa, which is great.
Anna Howard (11:19.037)
Inappropriate, extremely inappropriate. Yeah, what?
Brandon (11:20.753)
Right? Yep.
Brandon (11:28.25)
I mean, it was fucking rude.
Brandon (11:40.502)
Yep.
Anna Howard (11:41.605)
Okay, amazing. Now the listeners know some of the lore, probably not all of it. I'm sure more of it will come out with time, but.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (11:44.298)
Yes. There's, no, there's a lot more about that. Yeah. Great question though. Anna, you should be like an interviewer. So good. So good. Anyway, yeah, so interesting stuff. Oh God.
Brandon (11:45.418)
I know. Yeah. Oh, I'm sure it will.
Anna Howard (11:53.704)
Oh my gosh, you're so right!
Brandon (11:58.222)
She's like, how did that drama make you feel?
Anna Howard (12:02.475)
Can you imagine if I was like, so Kevin, how did that childhood? I like go on from what you said a second ago. I'm like, so what about that childhood? How did that make you feel? You're like, okay, I'll tell you.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (12:05.322)
Oh my god. Let's talk about your childhood. I'd be like...
Brandon (12:07.301)
Ha ha
Brandon (12:10.882)
Hahaha
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (12:12.45)
God, I'm such an open book too that I'd be like, let's dive in, but no, Jesus Christ. I know even in our improv classes, I'm like, wow, I can't believe I just told that story. Whatever.
Brandon (12:15.466)
Right.
Anna Howard (12:23.465)
I learned so much about you and improv.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (12:25.586)
I think everybody did and they were like, I do not want to know him. They're like, wow. Actually, I know there was that one time when we went to rat scraps that Shannon, like we took classes Shannon O'Neill, who was like a great improv, improviser. Improviser, thank you so much. That was really weird. Anyway, and she, I like rose my hand because they like get shit from the audience or whatever to be able to support their show. And,
Brandon (12:27.939)
Mm.
Brandon (12:31.298)
He's got a lot of stories.
Anna Howard (12:43.23)
Improvisor?
Brandon (12:44.926)
Yeah, it's like it's not that hard of a word.
Anna Howard (12:47.186)
Improviser.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (12:55.546)
I raised my hand and I was like, okay, I have this thing. And I talked about the fact that like my biological grandma, my mom's mom slept with two brothers, not her brothers, but two men that were brothers and had kids like with both brothers. And she like openly was like, yeah, I know him. His life is fucked up. And I'm like, you know, it's interesting. Anyway, all right, with all that said, shall we dive into?
Brandon (13:16.759)
Hehehehe
Anna Howard (13:19.647)
Oh my god.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (13:24.61)
the episode. Oh wait, a couple things to mention. Obviously, Homotown Murders, if you have one, email us, murder at homoscipodcast.com. And then hello, subscribe on YouTube, follow us on Apple.
Anna Howard (13:35.952)
Wait, but what is a hometown murder if somebody has never listened before?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (13:40.098)
This is why you're our producer. So for those who haven't listened, yes, Homo town murders are basically your hometown murder. We just wanted to make it gay, so it's a Homo town murder. And it's basically you write us and let us know what that murder is all about with all of the details. And then you can join us on the podcast to tell it to our listeners and us, which is exciting. So if you have that, email it to us at murder at homosidepodcast.com. Thank you, Anna. And then also, yes, subscribe.
Brandon (13:42.607)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (14:08.818)
subscribe on YouTube and then follow us on Apple and on Spotify and then please leave us a review, rate us and review us we would love to hear from you. And that's that. So Brandon, I think you go first today.
Brandon (14:20.822)
that's the spiel. I do. Are you ready to hear about the porcelain rage? That I quickly just created the headline, so I think it makes sense, so we'll go with it. Okay, cool. So on May 31st, 2006, a woman named Jessica, and I don't know how to pronounce this, I'll
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (14:24.344)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (14:30.059)
Um, I think we both are.
Anna Howard (14:31.335)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (14:36.412)
Fantastic.
Brandon (14:51.722)
I'm assuming it's like, is that French? I don't know. Got a call from a man named Sean, the boyfriend of her best friend, Christina Eubanks, who is a 20 year old woman who lived in Tennessee. Sean moved to Wilmington, Delaware in 2005, and the two of them started their long distance relationship. And Sean would visit her often, meeting in 2004 while they were both, they both worked at the grocery chain Fresh Market.
The two quickly got attached and friends even noted that they were in love. And now by 2006, Sean was already in Wilmington, Delaware. And I didn't see why he ended up moving, but they continued their relationship into 2006. So calling and texting each other all the time, they were constantly in communication. So on May 29th, it was no surprise to Sean that they would be talking on the phone.
She let him know that she was going to stay home from work that day because her ever aching carpal tunnel Being that she was still a cashier her wrist would uh Hurt quite often and give her a lot of pain. So she was calling out of work that day From there They hung up and went on their day chatting a couple more times throughout the day Neither of them knew that when they hung up and said good night around 10 or 11 that evening that would be the last Time that they would ever speak By the time the 30 31st, I know I know that's always like a hard line
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (16:14.546)
Oh, little nuggets. That's sad. I know.
Brandon (16:19.099)
by the time, because you don't think of that when you're saying goodbye to somebody on the phone that, oh, that's maybe the last time I ever talked to you, right?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (16:23.466)
Yeah, I feel like that's like the normal. I know, well, and everyone I feel like in any 2020 or dateline, they're like, that was the last time that they would speak and you're like, Oh, that's totally true.
Brandon (16:31.482)
I know that's why I added it. I know. So by the time the 31st came around, Sean had not heard anything from Christina for quite some time. So obviously he was very concerned because they would talk all the time. He reached out to many of her friends and family and he would get the same answer that they haven't heard from her. Now Sean thought that this was weird because Christina was not the type of person to not answer people. She was not secretive and she was pretty open. She was a pretty open book.
Then when he heard that she did not go to work, she did not go to work for her next shift, he got even more concerned. So when Jessica got a call from Sean, she got a little bit worried. She also had not heard from her, so she figured she would head over to her apartment to check it out. With an uncomfortableness that came over her, Jessica decided to make her way to Christina's basement level apartment in the Fort Sanders area of Knoxville, Tennessee around 5 p.m. that evening. When she arrived,
She obviously tried knocking on the door, but nobody answered. One of Christina's neighbors though, Bill, also hadn't heard from Christina either, and he stopped to help. Deciding to open up one of the windows of Christina's apartment, they were both just surprised to hear her dog barking and the noise of her phone ringing in the distance because Jessica was trying to call her.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (17:51.05)
Okay, is this a little bit weird, but like, Bill, her neighbor, didn't hear from her either. Did they talk a lot? Like, do you guys talk to your neighbors a lot?
Brandon (17:57.694)
Well, I think it was just like a small little thing. Like, I think there was only a few units. So I think Christina was just a bubbly, friendly person and he happened. They just knew everybody. It's not like, like we're talking about Tennessee. We're not talking about like New York, where you don't know any of your neighbors and you are right next door. People actually know their neighbors in different areas. I know you do, which is bizarre. Don't get murdered.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (18:02.817)
Oh.
Sure. Okay.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (18:16.599)
Yeah, I talk to our neighbor now, Brandon. She's very nice. I know.
Brandon (18:23.254)
Anyways, opening the window more, Bill stepped inside of the apartment and opened up the front door for Jessica. Entering the home, Jessica was immediately really confused. First, she was confused to see that Christina's dog was locked up in the bedroom. There was no food or water out for the dog and there was feces piled on the floor, which is not common occurrence for her dog because Christina's dog was very well behaved. And Christina was also not one to just leave her pet. If she was going out,
if she wasn't going to be around and she was going out for too long, there was always somebody at the ready to take care of the dog in her absence. So Jessica continued on, alarmed by the state of Christina's room. She was quoted in the trial saying, her bedroom was very, like the stuff was scattered all over. Sheets were thrown to the side of the bed and hanging over the side of the bed. And there was just random items, like all against the wall on the side of the bedroom that
was out of the norm. Jessica was also confused to see random things out of order like the toilet tank lid was missing and the living room furniture was not where they usually were. Like the couch was askew, the coffee table wasn't where it was supposed to be.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (19:35.534)
Wait, I'm sorry, the toilet lid was missing? Huh.
Brandon (19:39.142)
Yeah, just random things. Like it was completely out of the blue. Like it just felt very random She also noticed that all of the belongings that one would have when they leave the home were still there Like her purse was there Her phone was still there obviously and even her glasses were left on the side table Which was very odd because Christina had very poor eyesight and there was varying sizes of white fragments strewn about the apartment so
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (19:44.302)
Weird.
Brandon (20:07.066)
Jessica decided to call the police and filed a missing persons report as I feel like anybody would at that point So soon after the police arrived to the apartment and immediately they started to notice some things were off first They see the same white fragments Jessica pointed out outside of the apartment on the driveway Then they entered the apartment and they started to see something Jessica did they started to see some things that Jessica did not there was
blood droplets on the vinyl flooring and absorbed into the carpet. There was slight blood splatter on the wall and blood on a bottle and a vodka bottle nearby. So on a water bottle and a vodka bottle, there was blood on it. They also saw a pair of sweatpants thrown by the TV. And in the bedroom, they saw a vibrator stained with blood. So yeah, so from here, they immediately thought something bad happened.
And this is where I'm going into a lot of detail, but this story is a hard one. When I first started it, I didn't realize that it was gonna be as crazy as it is, but this...
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (21:15.85)
tell me the vibrator was the murder weapon. Okay. Oh my god, this is just...
Brandon (21:19.11)
No, but it was used in the murder. Yeah, so Yeah, so When the police started their investigation, um, I saw a few sources that say some of her friends were Worried about talking to the police. So again, this was back in 2006 and at a time when marijuana was not legal and A lot of her friends were afraid of getting caught with weed So now christina herself was a pot smoker as well being that she had carpal terminal it helped with her symptoms
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (21:38.709)
Mm.
Brandon (21:48.798)
And most of our friends also smoked. Even to the point where one of our friends wouldn't let the police into their home because they were afraid of getting caught. Which the cops, from what I saw, were like, it's the least of our worries is your weed. Can we figure out this murder? So, however, one by one people's... Right, I know, I know. Yeah, we confiscate your weed and we will smoke it. So, yeah. So...
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (22:01.41)
Like whatever, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Anna Howard (22:05.017)
They're all like, we smoke weed too, it's fine.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (22:09.723)
I go, 100%. And we're going to smoke it in the car. Thank you.
Brandon (22:15.454)
One by one, people started to talk to the police, and most people talked about the same person. Joe Hill, or also known as Marvin Joseph Hill. And for the rest of this, I just call him Joe, because that's how it was in the case report. So, Joe was a 49-year-old married man who lived in the area that was also the local pizza delivery man and local marijuana drug dealer. Which.
You would think that juxtaposition is probably really good. Like I'll get weed and pizza. Great.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (22:42.614)
Wait, his name was Joe?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (22:47.664)
Wait, wait, his name is Joey makes pizza?
Brandon (22:53.092)
He doesn't make it, he just delivers it.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (22:55.37)
Oh, but he's a pizza delivery driver that is named Joe. What is this like correlation with Joe's and pizza? I love it so much. The reason I say is because Brandon's brothers has this lovely pizza stone thing in his backyard. And for Christmas, I was in a shop like in the West Village and found a candle that said, Joe, what did it say again? Joe.
Anna Howard (22:56.321)
He's Jo's Pizza.
Brandon (23:00.43)
Yes.
Brandon (23:20.67)
It said, the name of the candle was pizza from a guy named Joe. And it's like a tomato basil scented candle. It was so bizarre, but so perfect for him.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (23:24.674)
Oh yeah, pizza from a guy named Joe and I was like, that is so good. Yeah, it was perfect. I know, I feel kind of bad cause he opened it and he was like, hmm. And I'm like, I don't know how it smells. I just bought it. Capi. Yeah. Ew, ew, yeah. Anyway, sorry. Joe and pizza, all right.
Anna Howard (23:30.397)
Ew, that does not sound like a good candle though.
Brandon (23:37.27)
Well, and basil can sometimes smell like cat pee too. Right? Chris. Yeah, so anyways, so Joe, Christine, and Sean would often hang out together when Sean was in town. So Joe was their dealer, and they would commonly chill and smoke weed in her apartment. And it was also noted that at trial, that the three of them, alongside Joe's wife, Robin, would even travel together, sometimes going to Kentucky to play bingo, which I thought was weird.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (23:57.936)
pizza.
Brandon (24:07.362)
Kentucky to play bingo, but and they would even. Huh? Yeah, but also it's weird to. Like, but it's there in their 20s like going to play bingo to trap like it's just weird. Anyways. Kevin so logical about it. How many times have you crossed eight lines to play bingo?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (24:08.934)
I think that border is really close though. Like, depending where they live. I don't know. People from...
Anna Howard (24:18.317)
traveling to play bingo.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (24:21.754)
I'm going to Kentucky tonight to play bingo. Yeah, I mean, I don't know.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (24:29.546)
Let me think.
Brandon (24:30.122)
When was the last time you played bingo?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (24:32.438)
Hmm, let me think. I don't know. Rude. God.
Brandon (24:34.582)
Exactly. Okay. Anyways, they even noted that they would, they would go to Joe and Robin's house and spend time there as well. So from what I've seen about Joe is that he's had kind of a colorful past, but there wasn't too much I could find out about his childhood. But we do know that Joe has been in some trouble with the law before for burglary. Just a
Brandon (25:02.53)
Just a short time prior, he was released from a 13-year sentence for burglary in Ohio. So he was kind of, he understood the law and how things worked. So, um, so jumping forward back to 2006, um, I have a new person who enters the story and there's a couple of people who enter, but they're not really main characters here. They're just additive. So,
Here enters this man named Dustin. So Dustin knew both Christina and Joe, being that he was Christina's next door neighbor. He was also, he was friendly with her. And he often smoked weed with Joe as Joe was his dealer. I think Joe was just a very popular man in the area, just because he was a dealer. So in the, huh?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (25:42.63)
He's a dealer. I said, because he's a dealer. Yeah.
Brandon (25:47.062)
Yeah. So in the morning hours of May 30th, Dustin was walking back to his house after a long night of drinking and smoking weed the whole night. And he was a little surprised to see Joe coming out of Christina's apartment. They spoke briefly and Joel told him that he was helping Christina's boyfriend move out. And and Dustin didn't really think anything of it. But again, he was also he was impaired. He was drinking and smoking all night. So his
His brain wasn't in the right mind to really understand what was happening. So while they were talking, they decided to go to a convenience store nearby, and they walked together. However, Joe headed back before Dustin did. When Dustin got back, he was a little puzzled to see Joe laying down in the backseat of his car, right outside of the apartment. He then told police that Joe saw him and he sat up. He's quoted to tell him the authorities that,
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (26:21.066)
Mm-hmm.
Brandon (26:44.886)
Joe was acting somewhat shaky and a little upset, but he noted that his behavior was not anything that really alarmed him or anything else that made him know anything was going on. So Joe then reiterates to Dustin that Christina's boyfriend asked him to get there, to get some of his things for him. So now when Dustin hears this, when Dustin hears that Christina went missing, he quickly called the police and told him everything he knew, because he thought it was weird.
So part of this is, I was writing the notes from the case files of it. So this kind of follows the trial in general. So later in the trial, we'd also hear from another acquaintance of Joe's, Timothy Marshall, that on June 1st, he got a call from Joe asking to deliver a message to Dustin for him. And Timothy was quoted in saying that, he told me to tell Dustin that Dustin didn't know him.
Dustin didn't see him. He said it was a matter of life or death. He couldn't tell me right now. He'd tell me at a later time that it wasn't it. I delivered the message. That was very interesting to read. I'm reading a quote, so it's interesting because it's just the way of somebody talking. So he basically told, he told Timothy to tell Dustin that
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (28:02.57)
What? Yep. What?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (28:09.975)
Yeah, yeah.
Brandon (28:14.114)
He doesn't know who Joe is. They never met. He didn't see him that night. That it's a matter of life or death and that he couldn't tell him why, but he'll tell him later. To basically tell Dustin to not tell the police anything, that he knows anything.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (28:28.458)
And this was when, because of the backseat, when he was laying in the backseat of the car after that. Right, okay. Huh.
Brandon (28:32.714)
Yep. Yeah. Yep. So from here, the police started to get suspicious. So they got a warrant to go check out Joe's car. When they got there, Joe's wife Robin was there and she compiled. She complied. I have compiled. It's supposed to say complied. In there she come complied and they towed the car to the crime lab processing bay. Once they started to do testing, all of their suspicions came to light.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (28:51.436)
Wuh
Brandon (29:02.018)
They found blood stains on the back seat and spot remover in the car. On June 3rd, they arrested Joe Hill. However, getting a confession out of him would be hard since he was arrested before he knew how it worked. And he kept his mouth shut saying that he needed a lawyer. They did, however, note, notice that he had some scratches on his face and a bite mark on his hand.
The main goal that the police wanted to know was to find out where the body was because everybody knew that it was Joe it was very evident that Joe was the one who Had something to do with the disappearance of Christina due to the fact that there was blood that came back as being positive of Christina's so they went to Joe's wife to try to coax it out of him, so
Um, uh, luckily for them, one thing that Joe didn't really understand was that when you make a call from jail, it's recorded. Um, and so they went through all of the recordings and in the recordings. Yeah. Right. So he knew all of this stuff, but he didn't realize that the phones are recorded. So, so they have Christina called Joe and tried to coax it out of him. And in the recordings, they heard Joe talk about how he struck Christina.
Anna Howard (30:01.053)
Bruh, are you serious? What an idiot.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (30:06.114)
What an idiot. Oh my god.
Brandon (30:18.526)
in the first blow hit differently. And like, he's talking about the feeling and how it just felt different the first time he hit her. He also bragged to his wife that he had consensual sex and that he had consensual sex that evening. And to make her feel better, he was quoted to say that it wasn't even that fun. Eventually, Joe would come out and claim that the two of them were having an affair for a while. But the majority of people didn't believe him, especially because he was
really not attractive. He in the art, you'll see he was very unattractive and he was 20 years older than her. So people were like, yeah, we don't believe it. So after a bit...
Anna Howard (30:59.721)
Wait, I'm sorry, it is insane to say, yeah, we had consensual sex, but it really wasn't that fun as a way to justify cheating on your partner. Like you're talking to your partner and you're just like, yeah, I did have sex, but like, it wasn't that fun. Okay. Okay, I don't care.
Brandon (31:08.951)
Right?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (31:09.45)
Yeah.
Brandon (31:13.214)
It wasn't fun. I didn't have a good time. Okay. But she's also missing. So you did more than that. So after a bit of time, they got rough estimates of where the body was from what he was saying, which was in a remote area below a one lane bridge that no one would be able to see from the road. When the police got to the spot mentioned, they were not surprised to see her body below.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (31:13.47)
I wasn't that fun.
What the fuck?
Brandon (31:42.466)
They saw the yellow sheet that was wrapped around her waving in the wind along with some of the bloodstained items from the apartment, like a pillowcase, tablecloths, garbage, and more white fragments. So the police moved below, and I should probably just say trigger warning for the rest of this, just if you have a hard time listening to crime stuff, you probably don't wanna listen, but they saw her body lying in the water below. But by this time, it was a few days later.
So the body already started to decompose. Her skin was purple and starting to marbleize. And in spots, part of her skin was starting to hang off. And there was so much swelling, you could barely recognize her features. So what happened? So according to Joe, Christina called him on the night of May 29th, wanting some weed, agreeing he said he would head on over and he arrived around 11 p.m. that night.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (32:16.279)
Mm.
Brandon (32:40.546)
After a bit of time talking, watching TV, and hanging out with each other, Joe said that he was playing with her dog when the dog bit his hand, running to the bathroom to grab something to help clean up, Christian to put the dog in the bedroom and locked the dog in the bedroom so nothing else would happen. Then he said she came on to him, whispering in his ear saying, I know what you want. He then went into gross detail of their sexual acts and what they did together.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (33:04.471)
Okay.
Brandon (33:08.418)
that he said they did consensually. Once, then once finished, he said that Christina let him know that there was something wrong with her toilet and he asked him to help fix it, which to me was a very quick change of topic from sex to toilet. But allegedly this is what happened according to him. So as soon as he was in there, he made note that he had to end their affair, that.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (33:24.33)
Yeah.
Brandon (33:34.498)
He let her know that his wife was suspicious of them and they needed to stop. And he's communicating this through the walls of the bathroom. So then Joe said, he came out of the bathroom with the lid of the toilet tank still in his hand because he was working in the toilet, so he already had it. And he wasn't thinking, so he came out with it. He said, she started to humiliate him and she started to get a little bit irate. He was...
He was stated saying that he was that she was basically belittling him to make him feel like he was nothing so that he wouldn't leave her in this angered him a lot. So he said he got so angry he lost control and he punched her a few times when being in the face. I think the first one they said was in the chest. But then this didn't stop her and she got a little bit more irate and aggressive. So without thought, he grabbed the toilet lid with both hands and struck her with it. Once once.
She hit the floor. He noticed she was still breathing so she he kept hitting her Every time pieces of the tank would break off and fly around the apartment Eventually after a few blows he hears her Still making gurgling noises. So with the lid in his hands. He kept striking her until she stopped Then with a little bit of remorse He wanted to try to revive her and for some Yeah, right
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (34:49.866)
Oh, I think, okay. Oh, oh, after smashing her face in, okay. Cool, cool, cool.
Brandon (34:56.778)
So, for some reason, he had a stun gun with him. So to revive her, he tried to shock her back with the stun gun. This is the legend of what he did. Frantic leech.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (35:11.634)
I'm sorry that is really funny. It shouldn't be. But what a fucking idiot. What a fucking idiot. Well I smashed your face in bit let me use this stun gun as like a...
Brandon (35:14.614)
It's the most ridiculous thing ever. Right? You just, you just, yeah, you just beat her with this toilet lid and that's not gonna help. Yeah.
Anna Howard (35:23.221)
That also, that's like demented. Yeah, and I don't think he wanted it to help because when you watch someone suffering so much because you just bashed their head in and they're literally gurgling, as soon as there's silence, now you wanna bring them back? What, because you want them to suffer more? Like that's not.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (35:27.423)
It is demented, yeah.
Brandon (35:36.877)
Yeah.
Brandon (35:42.474)
Right, exactly.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (35:43.91)
Or he's like, oh fuck, I just killed somebody. I mean, it just, the stupidity, which this is why it's funny, the stupidity of thinking that you could revive somebody with a stun gun. What a fucking idiot. His stupidity is hilarious. Like it's just, wow. Wow. Okay.
Brandon (35:55.434)
Yeah, I agree. So, well, we're not done. So, frantically trying to figure out what to do, he tried to devise a plan. So his hand was severely injured and he couldn't pick up her body because he, I think it said he broke his hand, but I think with the dog bite, it was, he was injured so he couldn't physically pick her up himself. So he looked around and he decided to grab the nearby,
leash of the dog. He wrapped it around her with the blanket and dragged her to his car. And he says not to strangle her, but just to drag her. Again, doesn't make sense. He then disposed of the lid of the garbage of the lid of the toilet in a garbage that was 10 blocks away and then he said he went to the bridge and dropped her off of the bridge, hoping to hide to the body.
Now, expert testimony said that he's not telling the truth. Surprise, surprise. So according to the medical examiner, Christina was first struck on the back of the head with the toilet lid and he continued to hit her. He hit her so hard it broke her skull and damaged her brain. Then she was strangled. However, Joe did not know was that at this point Christina wasn't actually dead.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (37:00.582)
Bye.
Brandon (37:24.734)
after he beat her and strangled her and dragged her to the car and dispose of her body, she was still alive. And examination showed that she dried from choking on the water in the creek in her own vomit, meaning she was alive the entire time that everything was happening. So the prosecution believes that Joe came on to Christina.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (37:49.101)
No...
Brandon (37:52.97)
and she declined, so he stunned her with a stun gun to sedate her. And then when she woke again and declined to him, it enraged him and he attacked. They believe that he went to the house that day with a purpose, a purpose to sexually assault Christina. Joe's defense tried to claim that the confession over the phone while he was in jail was illegal because he said he wouldn't talk without an attorney. So they said them coaxing his wife for information was obtained illegally.
However, in trial, it was deemed that with how the body was disposed, someone would have seen her, and at some point it would have all come out anyways. And so when the jury went to deliberation, not many people believed his story about there being an affair. And just after three hours of deliberation, the jury came back with a guilty verdict of first degree murder of manslaughter and abuse of a court.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (38:21.401)
Okay.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (38:48.427)
Jesus. Wow. What year was this again?
Brandon (38:50.622)
Yeah, so I went into this one not thinking it was going to be too, too crazy. And then I kept going and I'm like, Oh my God, there's more. There's more and more. So.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (39:02.578)
What year was this one? Geez.
Brandon (39:03.898)
2006. So fuck you Marvin Joseph Hill.
Anna Howard (39:09.505)
Those are the most disturbing ones to me that are like, it's torture what they're doing to people. It's not just murder because I mean, if you shoot someone right in the head, at least it's quick, but that is not quick.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (39:10.946)
Hmm
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (39:15.371)
Mm-hmm.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (39:22.955)
Mm-hmm.
No, it's horrible. It's horrible. Well, and like to stun her all that kind of shit while she was like still alive is horrible. But I bet you the dog bit him because he was murdering her. I wonder if that's more of yeah. Yep, that's what I'm thinking too. What a fucking dickhole. Wow, that is so he so basically he will okay so I'm still stuck on the weird vibrator.
Brandon (39:27.149)
No.
Brandon (39:37.458)
Oh, I would assume so she was probably it was probably during the attack.
Brandon (39:54.922)
Well, it was part of the sexual acts. He was, he did things with her body. Yeah, and so there was, yeah. Yeah, it was just a part of the sexual assault.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (39:57.578)
Oh, because he raped her. Oh my God, I can't. Ooh, okay, yeah, ew. He's a fucking jerk. Wow, Brandon, that is a bizarre murder weapon, but also just, oh, my laundry's done. Which will go off for a hot minute. So talk amongst yourselves since we're recording. I'll be right back.
Brandon (40:10.518)
A really fucked up story.
Anna Howard (40:20.805)
When you said that he was a pizza guy, my first very different pizza guy in my head was my old manager at this Italian restaurant that I worked with, who he was technically the owner's son. So he could have like climbed the ranks, but he was kind of, he was kind of a dummy.
Brandon (40:30.382)
Yeah
Anna Howard (40:43.797)
So he didn't want to. And his entire, he was so happy just making pizzas. Like he loved making pizzas more than anything in the world. Like if he, the rest of his life, he probably wants to make pizzas. He did not want to be a manager at all. He hated managing. He was like, I just want to make pizzas. Very different pizza guy in my head, but I was picturing him. So now my brain, unfortunately, thinking of him doing that to someone.
Brandon (41:05.142)
Yeah, different.
Brandon (41:13.914)
It's awful.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (41:14.986)
I missed half of that, but that just was sad.
Anna Howard (41:17.725)
You know when you have like an image, like if there's a specific detail in a story, your brain immediately pictures whoever it is that you know that has that detail, you know? So if anybody knows any pizza guys, hopefully they're not killing anybody with toilet seats.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (41:23.072)
Mm-hmm.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (41:27.938)
Totally, yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (41:34.766)
You know, make them leave the pizza at your front door. Don't let them in. I don't know.
Anna Howard (41:39.381)
Yeah. Wait, that reminds me of, there was a crazy story about a guy who, I think he was an Uber Eats driver or something in Florida and he ended up killing whoever it was that he like was delivering to. And no prior, yeah, no prior relationship with this person. It was just like, they ordered something on Uber Eats. Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (41:57.134)
I feel like I've heard something about that too, yeah.
Brandon (41:58.564)
I feel yo.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (42:03.234)
That's like that Uber killer. Yeah, no, thank you. That seat, mm-mm. I barely trust the food when it gets here in general. And if it's like slightly open.
Anna Howard (42:12.12)
That's why I always say just leave it at the door. Like I don't want, I don't, I don't know.
Brandon (42:16.462)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (42:17.366)
I know, I got something last night and they took a picture of my hand, it was really creepy. Like I- Brandon's like- Brandon actually ordered it for me. Um, because I've done like so well in 8 Home the entire week, so I was like, I want a crepe. And so, um, Brandon ordered it for me, because I don't order- I- This is so bizarre, but in relationships, I don't know, one person does something and the other one doesn't- Uh, whatever. Yes, so Brandon's the orderer.
Anna Howard (42:21.525)
Ew.
Brandon (42:21.567)
It was.
Anna Howard (42:37.562)
Yeah, there's roles. I'll do that and you'll do this.
Brandon (42:39.166)
Yeah, Kevin, yeah, he won't order any delivery even if we are not together, we're states away, I'm still ordering his food for him. You've done it before, but it's typical that you're just like, could you just get me this please?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (42:49.546)
I wouldn't say won't, I just have a four.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (42:56.086)
So I have this weird thing and maybe it's related to my ADHD, I don't know, but I get very overwhelmed by menus, like a lot. And if it's a menu that's like, I'm like, oh my God, do you have a chicken sandwich? And it's like, I just get overwhelmed. So anyway, sometimes with the ordering, there's too many choices and it makes me like, so Brandon helps. So he orders me grapes. Okay.
Brandon (43:14.414)
You can't handle it.
Brandon (43:19.038)
I know where I fit in my art relationship. I understand it, I get it.
Anna Howard (43:21.349)
Yeah, there it rolls. I get it, usually it happens the same way. My boyfriend is the one who orders things, but I think that's just because I don't wanna go through the trouble of signing into Grubhub. I don't know what my Grubhub login is and I don't wanna do the whole forgot password bullshit. So.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (43:33.23)
Sure. Yeah, same.
Yep. Because by the time you're like, okay, do I just make a sandwich or have a hard boiled egg? I don't know. Like it's annoying. So, but I got these crepes last night and the Brandon's like, it's there. And so I'm like, okay, great. So I went to the door and there was a guy there and I literally opened the door looking down and I was like, oh, and he was like, oh, hey, here. And then I took it from him and started closing the door and he's like, oh, I still need to take a picture. And I was like, oh, and so I like stuck it out and hid my face and he's like, I'm not gonna get your face. And I was like, thanks. So Brandon got a picture of it.
Anna Howard (43:42.993)
Yeah.
Anna Howard (44:03.263)
I'm sorry.
Brandon (44:04.554)
Right. And so I get the picture of Kevin's hand in the doorway. I was like, well, I see you got your food.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (44:10.09)
Which is gonna be, anyway. Yeah, I'm like, thanks. Jesus, so weird. Yeah, that too. Well, you know, I would, I, you know, I would put up such a fight that I think that somebody who would try to murder me would be like, this is not worth it. I don't know. Like I would be loud and aggressive and, and I have a weird strong grip in general, right Bran? Where like,
Anna Howard (44:13.273)
Yeah, good that you had evidence of it.
Brandon (44:16.634)
And I'm glad you didn't get murdered.
Anna Howard (44:18.705)
Yeah, that is nice.
Brandon (44:30.891)
I can't deal with this one.
Brandon (44:37.111)
You do.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (44:38.994)
You can't really move. It's really weird. I don't know. Like, Brandon and I will like fuck around and Oh, yeah. And I'm like, I know. Done.
Anna Howard (44:40.962)
Thanks for watching!
Brandon (44:42.574)
It's nice when you have like a kink in your neck and you're like, could you just Yeah, right. It is. It is really funny because if Kevin's ever like, Hey, could you rub my shoulder? Do this? He'll like, show me where it is on his body. And then come to me and, and like press and do it for me to show, to kind of just show me where to do it. But I'm always like, Oh, why are you going so fucking hard? I'm fragile.
Anna Howard (44:47.499)
Could you just crack my back in half for me? Thank you.
Anna Howard (45:06.382)
And you're like, keep doing that.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (45:08.47)
Yeah, Brandon cannot. I'm like, it's not that hard. Anyway.
Brandon (45:12.524)
Oh, but you are.
Anna Howard (45:12.861)
See, I can't get massages in the city because they always go too hard. And even, I just, and then I feel really uncomfortable because I'm like, I don't wanna tell them to like do their job differently, you know? So I'm just, I'm like, ugh, just taking it.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (45:19.186)
I maybe need that.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (45:27.35)
She's like, mm mm. That's really funny. I love massages that in fact, I usually they can't go hard enough. And the last one that we got in Vermont was okay. But the one before that I had this dude and I'm like.
Do you, he, first off, he wouldn't go past like my knee. Like he was very uncomfortable to go up my thigh. And I'm like, this is like, isn't this your job? This is, yeah, he was, he did not do my hips. He did not do like butt cheek, nothing. And, and it was so light that I was like, that was dumb. But yeah, so I, maybe I should try in New York.
Brandon (45:53.11)
He was really scared to touch her booty.
Anna Howard (46:07.057)
I mean, I don't know if you're gonna think this, I'm sure you're gonna love it, because I feel like I've just been beaten up after I leave. I'm like, that was not relaxing.
Brandon (46:12.78)
Oh, he would.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (46:14.334)
I would.
Brandon (46:17.042)
Yeah, I feel like I could. I feel like I could take a bat and literally hit Kevin in the back and he'd be like, did you do something? He likes it so it's so hard where my hands are like on fire trying to rub his shoulder. I'm like, I'm trying my best. I can't help it.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (46:17.212)
Oh my god.
Which is not good. It's not fun.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (46:28.098)
So I think that might be a little different.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (46:36.526)
I know. I get all of my stress is like held within my like, upper back and neck and shoulders. And so you have to go like really pretty hard, because I can't really feel it a ton, which maybe is an issue. I don't know. Maybe. Oh my god. All right. Well.
Anna Howard (46:43.67)
Yeah.
Brandon (46:50.374)
We should probably get that checked, just in case. If there's a doctor listening to the podcast, if you have any ideas.
Anna Howard (46:57.543)
Let us know.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (46:57.706)
Is there a condition that can also match my skin condition that I just got diagnosed with? Cause that would be great. Anyway, my Lord. Okay, getting older is fun. So great. All right, should we go into my story? It's much quicker and maybe more funny. I know yours was like, I actually felt sad at the end of yours. So Christina.
Brandon (47:08.586)
Right, you just slowly start to fall apart.
Brandon (47:15.79)
Let's do it. We need to know about the pumpernickel.
Brandon (47:23.406)
Right?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (47:27.486)
Um, okay. Well, you guys, I titled mine again, and it's very simple. It's just titled, Oreginald. So, it was January 25th. Yeah. What do you take away from this already? What can you maybe... Okay, love that, love that.
Brandon (47:39.111)
Okay, so the two takeaways we have so far is Reginald and Pumpernickel.
Anna Howard (47:47.601)
sounding like a cartoon to me right now.
Brandon (47:50.606)
It sounds like a like a old story of a white man in his bread.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (48:00.486)
Okay. I think there's a version of that.
Brandon (48:01.694)
Am I close? I mean, who eats pumpernickel? Whenever I think of pumpernickel, I think of like old, like just old people, like older than my grandparents old.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (48:09.534)
Well, so there are some Colton locations, cultures that do eat it, and Britain is one of them. So my story is a British. So, Reginald. Okay.
Brandon (48:21.966)
Well, that makes sense.
Brandon (48:27.978)
And are we going to get your British accent the whole time?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (48:31.526)
No, no. I thought about it earlier and then I tried it and I was like, well, that sounded dumb. So I didn't do it. Because there are some quotes in here. No, I will not. Thank you. Okay. Someday. I mean, I do it sometimes when we're like, doing stuff or whatever. I don't know, I switch between like an Australian and a Brooklyn and a British and a country and it's just not great. So, yes.
Brandon (48:38.459)
Could you give us just like a little preview of what you were doing?
We'll get him to do it sometime.
Brandon (48:54.179)
Southern.
Anna Howard (48:56.605)
multifaceted.
Brandon (48:57.258)
I think it's entertaining.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (49:00.374)
So it was January 25th of 1988, when an article appeared in the Sarasota Herald Tribune opinion section with the headline, Hard Bread Can Double As Weapon.
So this is the story of the unsolved murder of Sir Reginald Hemsley Dottingdale, which by the way is the most British name ever. Sir Reginald Hemsley Dottingdale.
Brandon (49:25.082)
That is... I'm sorry, but it's unsolved, but we know that he was murdered with bread?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (49:31.338)
Yes, which is interesting. And there's like no information on this, like at all. So I don't really have much. So we're just gonna take a little journey down some history about pumpernickel bread and some other shit. So anyway, this, I know, I found this to be really interesting. So I wanna jump into pumpernickel bread first because it actually is interesting, but.
Brandon (49:46.366)
Exactly what we all want to hear. I'm excited.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (49:55.914)
I hate pumpernickel bread by the way, but pumpernickel bread if you haven't had it is super dense, very dark, and very hearty. So if you need to shit, very good. But it also tastes like rye bread, which if you know me, you know that I fucking hate rye bread. Like a lot.
Brandon (50:08.862)
you cannot stand. Like, Kevin even hates the rice seeds that are in everything bagels. Like, if there's a bagel with a rice seed in it, he will not have it. And I'm like, it's the best bagel.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (50:15.463)
Uh...
Anna Howard (50:20.041)
Wait, I actually, I'm the opposite. I love, I love a seated bread. I love a seated bread.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (50:25.635)
Oh god. I cannot stand it.
Brandon (50:25.978)
I do too. Kevin is always the white bread kind of person. Even if we try to get like wheat, he might do like the honey wheat, but you won't do any kind of wheat with any seed in it.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (50:36.014)
I like white, I like wonder, orphanage style wonder bread. I grew up in an orphanage and so they did not.
Brandon (50:43.321)
Do not say Orbitage style, not government bread.
Anna Howard (50:43.633)
You should, well, the orphanage, I want to read. You should put on your actor hat and act like a pilgrim for a day and see how it influences your bread taste.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (51:00.15)
My, hmm, that's really interesting.
Anna Howard (51:04.659)
Just think like a pilgrim.
Brandon (51:05.038)
He's like, no.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (51:07.936)
Maybe I'll go out to the ruins in Salem and Dressen. What?
Brandon (51:09.534)
Minus all like the...genocide.
Anna Howard (51:13.001)
What? You just said the word gen. Oh. Honestly, I just, my, I literally just saw you go, genocide, and that was it, and I was like, I was like, wait, what are we talking about?
Brandon (51:15.21)
You said act like a program. I said minus the genocide.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (51:18.702)
Oh, yeah. I was like, what are you talking about?
Brandon (51:21.41)
You know, in the-
Brandon (51:26.784)
Hahaha
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (51:30.918)
It's the same thing that I saw, that's why I was like... Where did we go?
Brandon (51:32.458)
I know, I'm sorry. I'm sorry, because as I was.
Anna Howard (51:34.345)
You're so right though, pilgrims and genocide are deeply connected.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (51:37.758)
and genocide. And seeded bread, apparently.
Brandon (51:38.938)
They are. Right? I know. And as I was saying it and I got closer because I was like, oh wait, is Kevin speaking? I can't tell because I was talking at the same time you are. And so we totally did that. And I feel like now that we're-
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (51:49.603)
You know what I do like though? Feel like what? What Brandon? We're still on genocide, keep going.
Brandon (51:54.266)
I have to say now that we're doing this virtually for right now, it's gonna happen a lot where we're gonna talk over each other.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (51:59.558)
I know. Like, we do that anyway. But... Oh, I just got a beard here in my mouth. There she is. Okay. The joys of having a beard. Um, I don't remember where we were. Shit. Now I have genocide in my head. Pilgrims. Oh! The type of bread I do like is sprouted bread. Which does have also some seeds in it, but it tastes very different. I don't know. Okay, wait. Do I love it? I love it with a lot of butter and honey on it.
Brandon (52:02.027)
We do.
Brandon (52:06.03)
Gross.
Brandon (52:13.818)
pilgrims pumpernickel
Anna Howard (52:25.79)
I don't know the difference.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (52:30.382)
delicious, but that's it. Okay, pumpernickel bread. Back to it. Oh, the other thing that I really don't like is Brandon loves everything bagels, but once he's done eating them, he has so many black little seeds in his teeth that I'm always like, you know, can you handle that?
Brandon (52:36.953)
The more you know.
Anna Howard (52:37.173)
Ha ha ha.
Brandon (52:45.283)
Yeah. Yeah, but then he doesn't tell me and then it'll be like an hour later I'll go in the mirror and be like, why didn't you tell me my teeth are disgusting right now? Right?
Anna Howard (52:45.517)
Yeah, that's rough.
Anna Howard (52:53.11)
Road.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (52:54.706)
I don't- I'm not investigating your teeth, you weirdo. Like, I'm not like, wow.
Brandon (52:57.822)
No, but you were supposed to like, you know, look at me when we're engaging with each other and one would notice.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (53:02.57)
I do, I look at your eyes and your tip of your nose, and then I don't look at, I'm not, oh my God, anyway. Every time that I'm like, oh yeah, I did see, oh no, yeah, I did see just a little speck. I'm just not like, oh, pause our conversation. Can you pick that out of your mouth? I don't know, whatever. Anyway, all right. Pumpernickel bread. You're welcome, you always do, gross. Figure your life out. Get some tooth ticks. Wait, tooth ticks?
Anna Howard (53:17.453)
Thanks.
Brandon (53:22.33)
It's fine, I'll just have shit in my teeth.
Thank you. Do I, I don't.
Tooth ticks? I don't want any ticks in my teeth.
Anna Howard (53:34.686)
keep those away.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (53:34.815)
Tooth, Hicks, God, we're messy. Anyway, okay. So guys, pumpernickel bread originated in, where do you think it originated in?
Brandon (53:44.066)
pumpernickel? is that like a name of a place?
Anna Howard (53:46.285)
Uh...
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (53:46.616)
No.
Anna Howard (53:48.854)
the UK.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (53:50.854)
it originated in Hermony, AKA Germany, which I did not know. Yeah. So I found this actually kind of really funny. Pumpernickel actually does mean something and comes from some different words in Germany. So it's actually a German word that comes from pumpern, which actually means to break wind, AKA fart. And nickel.
Anna Howard (53:54.393)
Oh, that was my second guess.
Brandon (53:55.49)
Harmony.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (54:18.218)
Apparently, the take on the name Nicholas, which is associated with goblins and devilish character. So the word pumpernickel comes from the bread's, this is kind of funny, the overall word comes from the bread's reputed indigestibility, because it's so fibrous that it really, you get some poops. So basically, the word, so think about it, farts, devil, goblin. So basically the word means that you're eating the devil's farts.
Brandon (54:39.503)
Good to know.
Anna Howard (54:48.605)
Yummy. Delicious. Mmm.
Brandon (54:49.966)
Delicious throw some honey on that
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (54:50.026)
Yeah, so, yeah. Some devil fart honey, yeah, interesting. So I did find this to be very interesting because I like making bread. But bread is actually created, so like the flour that's used in pumpernickel bread is actually created from whole rye berries that are coarse to the ground. There was more than that, but it got really technical and I was like, I don't care. So I stopped there. But the German way to make it,
is actually by combining sourdough starter, yeast, and that flour, which if anybody does any sourdough type of starters and sourdough bread, I love sourdough bread. It's really yummy and in fact we had a starter and in fact sometimes people have starters that are very old, but Brandon killed it. It was his anyway because I didn't make the sourdough bread. Wait, did you kill it or did you just, I don't remember what happened. We don't have it anymore though.
Brandon (55:46.122)
No, I just forgot to I just I left in the fridge and I didn't feed it and then I could have revived it but it just anything that's fermented if it just freaks me out sometimes I was like, I'm just gonna get rid of it and start a new one and then I never started a new one. I will eventually. Well, then we started living in two different places and I'm like, when am I gonna feed it because you have to feed them often. It's like a it's like a it's like a Tamagotchi you got to play with it engage with it before it'll die.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (55:48.45)
feed up. Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (56:01.398)
So there's that, yeah. So.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (56:07.534)
That's true, I know, now we just need to...
Anna Howard (56:11.501)
I know, I didn't realize it was like an animal.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (56:14.846)
It is, yeah, you're feeding bacteria. It's really weird. Which, yeast, right? Everything, your bread goes from yeast anyway. But, so pumpernickel bread is really an interesting bread. You actually cook it in loaf tins at a temperature that's super low and you cook it for 24 hours, which is why it's actually super brown. Other cultures like add dyes and all that kind of stuff, but the German way, apparently, yeah, that's how long it has to cook for, which I'm like, no, thank you. So.
Brandon (56:15.738)
It is.
Anna Howard (56:21.215)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (56:44.77)
pumpernickel bread, the devil's farts. So with that, let's talk about this murder. Again, not a lot of information, but sometime in 1987 or 1998, I'm not really sure, Sir Reginald Hemsley Dottingdale was found deceased with a large lump on the back of his head. So the Scotland Yard began investigating the death with one investigator being quoted as saying,
pumpernickeling I've ever seen. The poor chap never knew what hit him.
Brandon (57:19.01)
Humpernickeling, it's like a coins term.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (57:19.534)
Would you guys like to? Yeah.
Anna Howard (57:20.205)
Okay, imagine you get murdered and then it's all just like making jokes about the way you were murdered.
Brandon (57:27.304)
I know that sucks.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (57:29.749)
Which is horrible and I tried to do this with like a British accent and I was just laughing through it so I couldn't do it. But I thought that I was like Scotland Yard, which I've heard before but I'm like, well that's interesting let's expand. So the Scotland Yard is the headquarters of the London Metropolitan Police and is responsible for policing London's 32 boroughs. Which by the way I didn't know London had the 32 boroughs.
Brandon (57:52.154)
Yeah, that's a lot.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (57:53.474)
So the Scotland Yard is located now on the River Thames at Victoria Embankment, just north of the Westminster Bridge in the city of Westminster. So the London police force was actually created all the way back in 1829 by an act that was introduced in parliament and replaced the old system of watchmen, which that word creeps me out. I'm not sure why.
So the Scotland Yard is, its headquarters has actually relocated three times in history, landing where they are actually now. So it's called Scotland Yard because the former entrance of the Whitehall Place headquarters, which faced the St. James District of Westminster. So originally Whitehall Place had an exit that was called the Great Scotland Yard, which was named that because it originally housed the Scottish royal family when they visited England's capital.
So after expansion, it was used as the main entrance to the PlayStation and later shortened to Scotland Yard. So from there, the Metropolitan Police became synonymous with that name. So now they're just like known as Scotland Yard, which I found to be very interesting. So they've moved those three times and now they're at that place that I had said, which is not at that exit anymore, but now they're just known as the Scotland Yard. So near Sir Reginald Hemsley, Doddingdale's body was a loaf.
of pumpernickel bread with the approximate hardness of an anvil. Do you guys know what an anvil is? Because I sure didn't.
Brandon (59:21.626)
Oh my gosh.
Anna Howard (59:23.846)
That's an an- I mean I don't actually know what it is but an anvil to me is something you hit somebody over the side of the head with. HAHAHA
Brandon (59:32.687)
I think of cartoons like them dropping on people like on cartoons They're like the big like hard heavy metal like weights, right?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (59:32.94)
Yep.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (59:36.158)
Okay, yes. It was like the Road Runner. Yes, yes. So an anvil is a heavy steel or iron block with a flat top, concave sides, and is typically pointed at one end. So like, yeah, the Road Runner, those episodes they would drop from the cliff and it would hit that. So.
Anna Howard (59:36.905)
Yeah.
Brandon (59:50.882)
Yeah.
Brandon (59:54.55)
Yeah. Yep. I was thinking of like the Animaniacs. Like I feel like there was a lot of Anvil dropping that. Why was there so many Anvil droppings in our childhood? Like that's very bizarre, right? It's like, it's like quicksand. There's a lot of stories of quicksands like that makes you think that I might encounter quicksand at some point in my life. No, you don't. No. You're never going to. At least yet.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:00:00.55)
Oh yeah, oh my God. Yes. I don't know, it's really fucked up. So I know, and I'm like.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:00:17.922)
I mean, or you do and you just, no one knows because you're dead in the quits and I don't know. So this anvil is actually a metalworking tool because I'm like, I still don't, like I don't know what it's used for. So it's a metalworking tool that's used to forge and shape metal. It was way more widely used before modern welding technology. So that makes sense. So I'm like, oh. So they actually believe that the pumpernickel loaf,
Brandon (01:00:22.924)
Hahaha
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:00:48.174)
to they believe it was the murder weapon because it actually perfectly matched the indentation found on the skull of Reginald. And it was found right by him. So they were like, Reginald has been murdered by quite hard, which by the way, I don't know if you guys realize, but if you leave a loaf of bread out for way too long, it gets very hard. And it's because like the...
Brandon (01:00:57.786)
How hard was this loaf of bread?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:01:15.234)
the moisture is drawn out of it, and so it just hardens in general. So it can get pretty hard.
Anna Howard (01:01:18.909)
Okay, wait. I was about to say, why don't we just use bread as bricks then, but then that makes sense that if it rained, then it would just become bread again. So we can't do that.
Brandon (01:01:27.002)
Ha ha
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:01:27.47)
It would become bread against like a sponge. The house is like, boo. And my house melted.
Brandon (01:01:32.934)
Right. Why's my house smell so moldy?
Anna Howard (01:01:35.236)
Ew. Soggy bread.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:01:39.306)
Ew. But it's interesting because you know, within a bag, like if your bread is in a bag on the counter, it doesn't really harden, it gets moldy because the moisture just like draws out and then yeah, just creates, hello, all that mold. So if it's out, like not in something in open air, then it will get hard. Which I feel is weirdly sexual to say. That felt weird for a second. Okay, anyway. So they are not sure if the loaf, I know.
Brandon (01:01:41.626)
Chris.
Brandon (01:01:55.757)
Yeah.
Brandon (01:02:06.41)
Of course he would take it there.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:02:08.686)
They're not sure if the pumpernickel bread that killed Reginald, Reginald Hemsley Doddingdale, they're not sure that if it was baked to be extra firm in consistency with the intent of murder, if it was just that and then it was grabbed and he was beaten. Yeah, I mean, it can happen. So interestingly enough about this story, that's it. That's all the information. It remains completely unsolved. Poor Reginald with his-
Brandon (01:02:22.554)
premeditated bread making.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:02:37.534)
indentation on his skull from pumpernickel bread.
Anna Howard (01:02:39.177)
Wait, so where did you say that he was found? Cause like, I almost feel like if he was like on the street or something, then what if somebody just like accidentally a piece of bread fell out of their window?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:02:43.622)
No clue. He was just known.
Brandon (01:02:53.386)
or drive by pumpernickeling.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:02:58.55)
I influe and hit him in the back of the head. I know. Yeah, and it's like, actually we don't know. I know, I'm like, can I find something? I even, I looked everywhere and I'm like, I cannot find any information on Reginald's case, even from the Scottish, the Scotland Yard. It was in 1988, so it was a little bit ago, clearly. But there's just, I'm like, was he a baker? Did he own a bakery? And I like.
Anna Howard (01:02:59.433)
And it's like a brick hitting you.
Brandon (01:03:02.894)
somebody threw it from their house cause they're like, this bread's too hard. Donk. Ha ha ha.
Anna Howard (01:03:06.853)
Yeah, yeah, they're like throwing it out.
Brandon (01:03:23.438)
But 1988 wasn't that long ago, right? Like...
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:03:28.31)
Was he out on a farm? Like I just, it's so.
Anna Howard (01:03:28.342)
Yeah.
Brandon (01:03:31.106)
Like even though you said what year it was, my head is like thinking of like, this was a long time ago on cobblestone streets and people were walking cause there was no cars. Like.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:03:36.854)
Like in the 1800s? I know, I know. It's exactly how I'm envisioning it as well. And yeah, it was in the 80s. I know, pumpernickeling. Worst case of pumpernickeling I've seen. Oh, how many cases have you seen? So speaking of which, Reginald is not the only chap in history to have been killed by pred in 1801.
Brandon (01:03:46.03)
the pumpernickeling. That's crazy.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:04:03.678)
another Welshman named William Hopkin was also killed by a loaf of bread in apparently or not in apparently a loaf of bread period. Apparently a laborer by the name of Morgan Hopkin threw a loaf of bread at William and he died a few years later. So the coroner actually stated that the bread throne delivered a mortal blow upon his private parts, which is what led to his murder.
Brandon (01:04:31.29)
I wasn't expecting that part.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:04:33.038)
Me neither. So there have been other reports of people trying to murder even like back in 2017 in a grocery store with bread, but it wasn't successful because they weren't hard, as hard as an anvil. So that's my friends.
Anna Howard (01:04:47.209)
Wait, this episode is reminding me of a show called Dead Like Me. Either of you ever seen that?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:04:55.818)
Yes, dead like, it was like on HBO or Showtime or something, right? Yeah.
Anna Howard (01:04:58.473)
Yeah, and it's about the first episode, a flying scrap of a toilet seat from space. Like something like blows up, it kills the main girl. Something blows up in space and like hurdles down to this girl who's in Manhattan standing there. And it's a piece of a toilet seat that like hits her on the side of the head and she dies. And then she becomes a reaper that like takes the soul of other people.
Brandon (01:04:59.472)
Yes.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:05:09.102)
Yeah, because it feels like the main girl, right?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:05:20.738)
from like the space station or something, right? Yes, such a good show. Although the little like creepy devil or like goblin things or whatever that she has to like get to them first, right? Like the Reaper has to go and like save the soul for it. Yeah, that show was great actually. It was really well done. Yeah, that's hilarious that it reminds you of that. I guess the...
Brandon (01:05:21.014)
I totally forgot about that.
Anna Howard (01:05:27.245)
Such a good show. You should definitely watch it if you can find it on streaming services.
Anna Howard (01:05:37.364)
Yeah.
Brandon (01:05:37.498)
They're like the black shadows.
Anna Howard (01:05:39.805)
Yeah, it's such a good show.
Brandon (01:05:41.45)
It was good.
Anna Howard (01:05:46.085)
I was just like, this is kind of, because my theory is that it was just, I mean, I don't know, an accident, like something.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:05:53.938)
Or it wasn't or like, was he carrying the pumpernickel bread? And like somebody was like, boom.
Anna Howard (01:05:57.365)
Yeah, I don't know. I'm literally picturing it falling out of the sky and hitting him and he's just like dead.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:06:03.638)
The pumpernickelloaf came from the space station and came hurling down. And now he's a reaper, I don't know. That's hilarious. Yeah, I found that to be so incredibly funny, which is not funny, but I found this article that was like weird or unusual murder weapons. And this one that was like pumpernickelbred, not only that, but his name killed me. Like Sir Reginald Hemsley Doddingdale.
Brandon (01:06:04.107)
All right.
It could have.
Anna Howard (01:06:08.065)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:06:33.514)
It's so British and it's so fun. Poor thing, died from a pumpernickel beating. But like also, like was he hit once? Oh, done. I don't know. Like it's just, I guess. I mean, if anybody out there has any information on this one, cause I couldn't find it, let us know because I'm interested to see what else they discovered in.
Brandon (01:06:35.03)
It is so British.
Anna Howard (01:06:35.403)
amazing.
Brandon (01:06:40.954)
That's so sad.
Brandon (01:06:46.306)
Well, if it's like an anvil, probably. With some hard ass bread.
Anna Howard (01:06:46.389)
Yeah, we don't know anything.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:07:01.474)
their investigation other than, you know, this, this police officer quoting, using his quote or whatever, which I can't find now in my notes. So there's that. Anyway, that one, that's that. So Brandon's was pretty meaty. Mine was, I like bro Brandon and I was like, mine's really short. So I'm just gonna expand on a couple of things like pumpernickel bread history.
Brandon (01:07:20.15)
there you go.
Brandon (01:07:27.415)
No, but it was a little bit more lighthearted, which is nice to have thrown in there too, because mine was not. So it was a nice way to wrap up the episode. Because at first I thought mine would be a little bit more lighthearted, but then it wasn't. I mean, not, I mean, we're talking about murder, it's not going to be lighthearted, but I thought it would be a different, I thought it was going to be more like yours where it was a little bit less agonizing to go through, but it was still a great story.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:07:32.814)
true.
Anna Howard (01:07:35.443)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:07:37.17)
I know. Then we should do this one again.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:07:43.125)
No.
It's never lighthearted, but...
Anna Howard (01:07:53.754)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:07:56.31)
Well, I'm, I feel like, um, mine is a little bit satirical. Like it's just, it's very much like this headline killed by pumpernickel bread. It just like, I don't like, how can that not be like, no, or like at all. Thank you. Yeah. But pumpernickel, pumpernickel bread, like I just.
Anna Howard (01:08:05.559)
Right.
Brandon (01:08:07.626)
I would like to not be killed by pumpernickel bread, please. Or any other bread of that sort, whether that's being beaten with it or choking on it.
Anna Howard (01:08:17.621)
Yeah, when you said pumpernickel Brad, my first thought was did somebody poison this guy? Like I thought maybe they just put something in the Brad, but this is much more of a mystery than that.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:08:26.274)
This is lonely. But also like, did they keep that loaf of bread for evidence? And isn't like sitting in some evidence locker right now, just this loaf of fucking pumpernickel bread? Maybe.
Brandon (01:08:36.899)
You never know.
Anna Howard (01:08:37.373)
it'll be really moldy and smelly if it is.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:08:40.318)
I know, but like was there blood on the bread? Was there, like I just, I'm like, I have so many questions. So many questions that are unanswered, so.
Anna Howard (01:08:43.213)
There must have been.
Brandon (01:08:47.551)
Right? Like, was there anything else? Like, was it only being hit by bread?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:08:53.326)
What's that? I mean, apparently, and I just envisioned them like in the coroner's office with this bread and being like, yeah, matches the indent. Like I just, like, I don't know. It shouldn't be funny, but it's funny. So yeah, that is my story of Reginald. That's why I said Reginald. You know, like, he didn't even know it hit him, this pumpernickel bread.
Brandon (01:09:02.383)
I'm gonna go to bed.
Anna Howard (01:09:06.054)
Oh my god.
Anna Howard (01:09:18.201)
Oh, Reginald.
Brandon (01:09:18.478)
Oh, rest.
Anna Howard (01:09:22.721)
Poor guy.
Brandon (01:09:22.874)
I mean, he might not have ever hit him in the back of the head. He might not have expected it to happen.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:09:25.006)
Poor thing. I know. Well, and it's the articles that I found, literally the Sarasota Herald Tribune opinion section. Like, why was it there? And like a couple of other, like, yeah, I mean, I think so. The Sarasota Herald Tribune, I mean, that's.
Brandon (01:09:36.514)
Right, is it, you mean Sarasota, Florida? Was it the Saras, because that's a-
Anna Howard (01:09:36.849)
Yeah, the opinion section.
Brandon (01:09:44.982)
Is there a Sarasota in the UK?
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:09:48.138)
Maybe, I don't know. I guess there could be. It didn't seem like it was written in like English from UK, but you know, the quote was very much English for sure. But that one, I don't know. Anyway, so episode 12 y'all, Bizarre Murder Weapons, toilet seat, was it a toilet seat lid? Like the porcelain, oh my God.
Brandon (01:09:54.518)
doesn't sound like a... no.
Brandon (01:10:09.026)
Yeah, well, they were definitely it was definitely bizarre. It was the toilet seat tank lid. So the top of it.
Anna Howard (01:10:10.343)
Boo!
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:10:17.494)
That shit's heavy. Wow. That's horrible. So toilet seat lid and a vertical bridge.
Brandon (01:10:20.644)
Yeah.
Brandon (01:10:28.058)
There you have it. Yeah, and Chainsaur will probably do a couple more of these ones because there's quite a few bizarre murder weapons.
Anna Howard (01:10:28.53)
Insane.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:10:28.918)
Very different murder weapons. Yeah. Anyway.
Anna Howard (01:10:34.773)
But both of them were bashing their head in, just with different things.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:10:34.85)
There were a few bizarre ones.
Mm-hmm. That's true. How did we do that again, Bran? Hmm. I was gonna choose another one, but then I was like, oh, it's intense. Even miles apart. Crazy. All right, well, exciting. So, friends, thank you for joining us on this adventure. But again, remember, yeah.
Brandon (01:10:42.443)
I don't know.
We're just so in tune with each other.
Anna Howard (01:10:48.444)
Hehehe
Anna Howard (01:11:01.536)
I'm gonna go.
Brandon (01:11:01.93)
Right? Be careful of flying pumpernickel.
Anna Howard (01:11:06.358)
Yeah.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:11:06.474)
Yes, please watch out for flying pumpernickel that feels like an anvil. Yeah, just ask the roadrunner. Um, all right.
Brandon (01:11:11.191)
You never know when it's gonna hit you.
Brandon (01:11:17.201)
the
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:11:18.754)
Guys, if you have any hometown murders, again, please email them to us at murd Please go visit our website as well. And if you would please subscribe on YouTube and also follow us right in review. And just have a lovely day and don't get murdered.
Good advice. Yeah, there we go. Anna Brandon, thank you for joining on this amazing journey of Homicide the Podcast. Yeah, I'm gonna go. That's it. Have a great day.
Brandon (01:11:41.39)
period.
Anna Howard (01:11:42.037)
Don't get murdered.
Anna Howard (01:11:48.417)
Thank you.
Brandon (01:11:49.206)
It was a good one.
Anna Howard (01:11:55.997)
Oh, okay. I'm gonna go. You know what, I'm gonna go.
Brandon (01:11:57.548)
Okay, goodbye.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:12:01.842)
Any parting messages? This was done. And I'm gonna go. Any last arguments from you?
Brandon (01:12:01.866)
Right? And imagine if his camera just like went dark at that time. His mic cuts out.
Anna Howard (01:12:05.694)
and I'm gonna go.
Brandon (01:12:14.574)
Arguments like this is a court
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:12:15.838)
I could end it like I end all client meetings. Any comments, questions or concerns?
Anna Howard (01:12:22.441)
I'm concerned that now when I walk outside of my apartment, I'm gonna get killed by a piece of pumpernickel bread.
Brandon (01:12:22.678)
Not from me.
Brandon (01:12:27.83)
All right.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:12:28.582)
Yep, yep, yep. I agree, I'm gonna look out for those flying pumpernickels. What, wait, what was that one word? Pumpernickeled? What did he call it? That police officer? Why can I not find this quote in my own notes? My Lord. Did I delete it? Oh, here. Pumpernickeling. So friends, don't go pumpernickeling anyone.
Anna Howard (01:12:40.461)
pumper-nickeled and dimed.
Anna Howard (01:12:55.241)
Wait, okay, so I looked up Reginald and Pumpernickel and I just clicked on the first article that came up and I just started scrolling. And one piece of this article, I don't think it has anything to do with this Reginald guy, but it just says, "'You're not just seeing things.' You're dying."
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:13:02.347)
Yeah.
Anna Howard (01:13:15.509)
And then it says, when approaching death, a person's brain starts to shut down in certain areas to focus on only the most necessary functions, much in the same way as the rest of the body. It's like talking about how people start to hallucinate. So if you start to hallucinate, you might be dying. And with that.
Brandon (01:13:16.278)
I'm sorry.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:13:29.718)
You could be dying. Yeah, so. That was Anna's parting message. Thank you for that encouragement. Oh my God, that's horrible. Wow, and on that note, today's takeaways. Don't, if you're hallucinating, you may be dead. Be careful of pumpernickeling. And stay away from pizza guys named Joe. I don't know.
Brandon (01:13:30.519)
Oh my gosh.
Brandon (01:13:35.426)
Have a great day. Enjoy the rest of your Tuesday if you're listening on the day it's sent out.
Anna Howard (01:13:36.564)
Yeah, you're welcome everybody.
Anna Howard (01:13:52.845)
You may be dead.
Brandon (01:13:58.903)
Yeah, maybe.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:14:00.206)
Is that the other one? Or maybe don't play with toilet lids? God.
Brandon (01:14:08.476)
glue down your lid.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:14:10.338)
Go down your way.
Anna Howard (01:14:11.002)
I would say maybe just like don't invite your drug dealer pizza guy to your home ever.
Brandon (01:14:11.685)
Just kidding.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:14:21.13)
Yeah, I would agree with that sentiment. Also, weed is like medically legal in a lot of places slash, you know, recreationally in some places. So I don't know, just go buy your weed from a store.
Brandon (01:14:24.323)
to know.
Anna Howard (01:14:34.389)
YAH
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:14:34.894)
I don't know. Yeah. All right. Well, there we go. So, everybody have a great day. Ooh, there's the church bells. And on that note, Jesus loves you so much. Goodbye.
Anna Howard (01:14:42.813)
Yeah, signing off.
Anna Howard (01:14:49.032)
Bye.
Anna Howard (01:14:53.4)
Okay.
Kevin Tydlaska-Dziedzic (01:14:53.668)
Alright.